Perfection my a** -- what happened?

[mherrcat]

I've been working on refurbishing my boom and was at the point of putting on the first coat of Perfection. Sanded the final coat of Epoxy Primecoat, vacuumed the dust, wiped the boom down with lacquer thinner. Mixed up a small amount of the Perfection according to directions in correct ratio. Did not thin as it seemed to be very thin already.

When I started to roll it on it immediately started to bead up like there was oil or something on the surface of the boom. I wiped it off with 2333N thinner then wiped the whole boom down again with 2316 solvent. (I was running out of 2333 and wanted to keep the rest for thinning if necessary; anyway, the 2333 takes longer to dry.) Tried to roll on the Perfection again and got the same results. Wiped it all off again.

The Perfection seems very thin. When I tried tipping it off (before I gave up and removed it all) the brush almost wiped it right off completely; and I was barely touching it with the tip of the expensive Badger hair brush.

I wanted to have the boom finished this weekend but now I have to wait until next week so I can talk to the Interlux tech people.

Somebody tell me what happened.

 

[Maine Sail]

They have

They have had a recall on certain colors, one being white. I would contact Interlux ASAP. Check SaiboatOwners & Sailnet as I saw some posts there recently by a guy doing the same project.

Never mind here's a link...

Perfection Problems

Fixing Perfection Problems

 

[mherrcat]

Thanks for the links.

I'm using their Jet Black paint as my mast is still black, as was the boom originally. Rolling and tipping as you read. I guess I'll have to wait and talk to the tech people. I've been doing everything as they say and measuring EXACTLY.

If I have to strip this back to bare metal I'm going to be REALLY pi**ed! At that point, for the money and time I've got invested, I might as well have had a complete new boom made by Ballenger.

 

[mherrcat]

Well, Interlux's first reaction is that it must be something I'm doing. No surprise there. I'm going to try another light sanding and cleaning with their 2316 solvent and try painting again. If it does the same thing I'm going for Pettit Easypoxy; it's a one-part polyurethane but if the Perfection isn't working, it couldn't be any worse.

They seem to be implying that using anything other than their products for wiping down the surface, cleaning brushes etc, is contaminating the surface; as if straight lacquer thinnner would do that, which I don't believe.

 

[Frank Langer]

I used Petit Easypoxy on a previous boat and found it to be very good. I used it on the hull, though, not on the mast.
Good luck!
Frank

 

[treilley]

Perfection should stick to virtually any surface. What happens if you try applying it directly to sanded wood or aluminum? It should not bead. The description of the paint being very thin already indicates it is a mixture problem. Have you ensured that there are no solids on the bottom of the can? Or the paint could be bad. Where did you purchase it? Was it shipped and possibly frozen? Did you get it at a local store that may have been a return from a disgruntled customer? I bought mine from my local WM. They matched very good pricing for me and I know that if there was a problem I could return it.


I do not think it is the primcoat. What about the laquer thinner? Have you tried any other solvents? Is silicone on the ingredient list of the thinner? What kind of cloth did you use to wipe down? Maybe detergent residue? I only use microfiber cloths. First wet with 2333 and then dry. I probably have some 2333 at home and could send you some to try.

 

[mherrcat]

I bought some new, white diaper cloth polishing rags and am going to do a light sanding with 360 grit, wipe down with 2316 solvent (faster evaporating than 2333) then tack cloth and try painting again. I used microfiber towels to wipe down before, but maybe they left some residue. I had washed them last week.

The tech guy said the consistency of the paint is supposed to be very thin; in fact he said depending on the color the first coat may even appear translucent. I'll probably have to put three coats over the white primekote. I made sure that both the base and the curing agent were very well stirred prior to mixing; at least 3 minutes for the base. There was nothing left unmixed. I bought the paint from Defender in Connecticut, so it was ground shipped to California. I really doubt it had frozen.

They are going to have an area rep contact me in a couple of days to come out and see what it looks like. Hopefully the work I do tonight will solve the problem.

 

[treilley]

When you say tack rags are you talking about a separate rag from the diaper cloths? Are they the tack rags you buy at paint stores that are cheesecloth with a sticky residue?

The Gray Perfection I used was not as thin as water. It had a decent viscosity to it and it was certainly not tranlucent. It covered completely with the first coat. I know this because I tested the viscosity on a glass pane to get the thinning correct.

 

[Martin King]

Not familiar with Pefection, but have lots of experience
with Sterling and Awlgrip. From your description, it sounds
very much like surface contamination, not a mixing problem. You should
be using clean cotton rags with whatever solvent they spec for
removing sanding swarf. If you use an inexpensive bulk product
like hardware store paint thinner, it will definitely cause problems.
And god help you if you are using one of those orange
cheesecloths the housepainters use. Those things will ruin your
your paint job right quick. Use only tack cloths designed for this product.
Before laying paint off on your boom, try doing the side of one of the thinner cans to see how
it behaves. Make sure the brush strokes flow out before it
tacks off. Only when you are happy with the test should you
proceed with the workpiece. Good luck.

Martin

 

[tenders]

"Swarf"

GOOD WORD!

 

[Poco A Poco]

Martin nailed it....surface contamination, anyone nearby (upwind) doing work? There are specific tac rags to use when using poly paints.

 

[mherrcat]

Had better luck last night. I think the dye in the microfiber towels I used to clean before left something on the surface. I cleaned three times with 2316 solvent and tried again. There were only a couple of places where there is a thin groove in the extrusion where the problem occurred again. I think it is going to be OK now.

The name Perfection probably refers to the perfection you have to excercise in preparing the surface! It does produce an almost mirror-like finish, which is good and bad; it shows every microscopic piece of dust that settles on it. I'm not sure there is a way to make my garage completely dust-free...

 

[treilley]

Dust is tough to avoid. We made a mini paint booth in our basement when we did our mast/boom/spreaders to minimize the amount of dust that attacked our finish. See the link to my photo site below to see the paint tent we setup. We also wet the floor.

 

[Poco A Poco]

As hard as it is, please remember that only you will be agonizing over the dust particles(plus the fact that there's different lighting "outside" versus a garage).
Once the mast is upright again, no one will "see" the imperfections, they'll see the boat with it's new shiny mast!

 

[Emerald]

Tim is right on with wetting down the surrounding area. Have had good luck spraying cars doing this. Wet as much as you can - walls even, and outside the door in the drive - keep that dust stuck down.

And, as already mentioned, you will be the most critical audience. I must sheepishly admit I didn't paint the bottom 6+ feet of my mast. Above the sail cover is one color, below another. Was in one of these messed up schedules where the stick was going up, but I wasn't ready, still cutting holes and banging around, so I left the bottom undone with the intent to finish it ASAP. Then something happened, and I went sailing, and a year (or two) clicked by. You'd think such a huge mismatch would jump out. I have to point it out to people. I'll finish painting it this year, after I finish the varnish...

 

[Martin King]

This subject of dust reminded me of my first experience ever with
linear polyurethane. I was doing the decks for the first time on my
39. The decks had been stripped of all hardware, masked, primed,
and blocked out. It was finally ready for topcoating after many, many
hours of prep work. The big day had finally arrived and a friend who
was an expert with LP had offered to get up early and drive from
his house 2 hours on a Saturday morning to be at my boat at 7. The
paint was mixed and we started laying it down. Halfway through
the job I hear a noise like the sound of tearing fabric. I look up
in time to see the guy on this old wooden powerboat 2 slips
upwind of me ripping off pieces of his ancient canvas deck. Apparently
he and his girlfriend had decided that this particular morning they were
going to start their boat renovation after the thing had been sitting
untouched for years. With every new tear, they put a plume of dust and
termites into the air that drifted right over our freshly laid paint. Yelling,
screaming, insults, profanities ensued but it was too late, my new paint job was ruined. My painter friend bailed on helping me any further, and I was
on my own to fix the mess. An expensive lesson indeed and my introduction into the world of marine paints.

 

[mherrcat]

Yeah, unfortunately it's the boom, so ignoring the dust might be hard, it's going to be right in my face a lot.

I'm going to see if there is a way to tent the boom when I do the final coat. Not too worried about the inital coats since they will be sanded. Wetting down is a good idea, but there is a lot of stuff in my garage.

I thought $1,500 for a new boom from Ballenger was more than I wanted to spend, but now I kind of wish I had just gone that route. Oh well...

 

[Dferr]

I painted my mast and boom last year, using Interlux Perfection, and it came out pretty darn nice! I followed the intructions to the "T". Are you waiting for the induction time? I remember after mixing the paint you're supposed to wait about 20 minutes or so before painting. Just a thought.

I think I read somewhere you said you are not thinning the paint. I didn't thin mine either, and I remember I thought the paint seemed to be pretty thick. I applied it using one of those foam rollers from Home depot.

 

[mherrcat]

I continued painting last night and it looks like it's working well. I spoke with the Interlux rep yesterday. Thinning is really only necessary in hotter weather, when the solvents will evaporate more quickly and the paint will start to thicken and the brush may start to drag. It's tricky to get the tipping-off right without brushing through to the primer. Maybe the next couple of coats will be easier.

Did you use the thick foam rollers that are about 1" in diameter with the small center hole, or the 1/8" nap foam rollers that fit on the standard roller handles? The thick one's look like they would work good, but I'm afraid they will absorb too much paint. I'm using 1/8" nap foam rollers from the local professional paint store.

I cleaned up the garage and wetted down the floor and the area outside the garage door and still had dust. Doing this in Bakersfield is not the best environment; there is always dust in the air, too much agricultural activity. Unless I get it into a paint booth (which isn't going to happen) I guess I'm going to be living with it...

 

[Dferr]

I used the white foam roller, 1" dia. and about 6" long. The rollers had the little hole.

Don