Boom

[Kevin Johnston]

I am in need of replacing my boom on my E27. Last time out I was flying a new North kevlar reinforced main and it was to much sail for my old bloom and the boom was folded in the middle. But boy did it make the boat go!

Is the spar with the same profile still available? I know I saw the profile in a catalog awhile back but I haven't find it since. Do you have any recommendations for a manufacturer to turn to for new stock?

Any recommendations for a used but similar could work to? (I checked Second Wave in Seattle and some riggers but no luck yet on the used side)

I am frequently out in the Straits of Juan de Fuca in the thick, so would it be worth the expense in buying something larger/stronger than the original?

I like the idea of rerigging the main sheet to the stern instead of over the companionway. From a leverage standpoint it would seems that it is a compromise to have the main sheet attached in the first 1/3 to 1/2 of the the length of the boom. Would there be a need for a traveler if the main sheet was mounted aft?
Thank you,
KJ

 

[Dave Hussey]

Hi Kevin,
I made an earlier post with pictures of the boom I replaced on my E27 a couple of summers ago. The cost was around $1200. I can recommend Lance Haag (or is it Hagg) at Seattle Yacht Riggers, who did beautiful work on my internal bails and reinforcement (mid boom sheeting). He uses LeFiel extrusions for the spars.
You can get a 'close to original' shaped spar from Rig-Rite in Rhode Island, but $$$$$$$$$$$$$$, but your end castings wont fit anyway, so there goes more $$$$$$$$$$.
Let us hear how it goes!
Search for this thread: Old E27 Gooseneck and Boom

 

[Kevin Johnston]

Boom replacement

I just made the purchase of my "new to me" replacement boom for my E27. It is more than enough to do the job; 12'7" long and I only need about 11 feet (probably keep it as long as I can without hitting the backstay), so I will be most likely cutting it down some.

It is already rigged for two reef points. I may have to move some of the bails but no problem. The spar should be quite abit stouter 6.5" X 3.5" oval compared to the 3"x4" tear drop shape orginal.

Got a hell of a buy on it on ebay (under $200) and found out my BAX Global commerical account is still in their system, so shipping will be $150 (Connecticut to Washington). Unless someone has a less expensive shipper that they can recommended?

Anyone have some pros and cons of straping the gooseneck to the mast or should l try and stay loose with a downhaul as the original design was?

I am contemplating building a stainless steel gooseneck (in another life I was a tool maker and still have an idle three axis milling machine sitting on my shop floor that needs to be used).

Should be a fun winter project. I will provide updates as I go. Love your thoughts? Thanks for your input.

 

[sleather]

Light Speed

Kevin, good score, can't beat the price! Mid boom sheating seems to eat alot of booms! We used to "trash" booms on E-scows @ the vang attachment, the end of the boom would "trip" on a wave & KABLOOOY!

You and Matt are a couple of "get'r done" guys! Must be a E27 "thang".

Hmmm-milling machine, I'm a self-employed CAD guy, I'm always designing parts that aren't made, interested in some small jobs???

I think there's a E27 just "sitting" @ a boat shop across the road from me(I'll check tomorrow).

The shipping thing seems a bit "out there", but it does get pricey over 10' that's why I'm thinking of getting my "spinnaker" pole thru W.M., not the best price but no shipping(internal delivery).

Just looked @ your info, You are soooo dedicated. That's one Loooong haul. You should move'r up to Lake Pend Oreille and sail some fresh, although where your at now must be spectacular!

 

[Seth]

Ballenger can do it

Ballenger Spars in Santa Cruz can supply very nice replacement spars-not the same sections, but he knows the engineering specs for the E-boat spars and has very nice mast and boom sections which meet or beat the specs-at very fair prices.

Check 'em out!
S

 

[Dave Hussey]

Congratulations Kevin.
Well, if you saw the pictures I posted of my similar project a few years ago, my recommendation would be to weld up a bracket that will bolt your gooseneck to the mast...but if I did it over again, I would make is much smaller....the forces are in compression on the mast point of contact, with very little shear, so you need a relatively small pad (mine is huge).
Mine works well, but isn't as elegant as I would have liked (in hind sight)

 

[Kevin Johnston]

Strapped boom vs. downhaul

I did find your thread and it really looked stout but your right, it is bulky looking. Thank you. Do you prefer the strap situation to a downhaul for the boom? Opinions on this.

As long as there is enough play to tension the halyard it would seem that a downhaul would provide no advantages. Am I correct here?

Since I am the machinist and tool maker I should be able to come up with a good looking and functional design. I usually way over build and your comments about compression compared to shear are helpful. I have already sheared one of the original gooseneck so it will be beefier than the original.

 

[sleather]

Same Stuff

As long as there is enough play to tension the halyard it would seem that a downhaul would provide no advantages. Am I correct here?

Since I am the machinist and tool maker I should be able to come up with a good looking and functional design.

Kevin, As the 23'-27' share the "same" Mast, boom & Hdwr.- 3 thoughts.

I frequently use the downhaul when "entertaining" on the boat. I raise the boom about 6" to prevent/reduce the number of head bashing incidents for the non-sailors onboard. That may not be an issue on the larger 27.

I have 2(1 spare) machined billet "sliders" that the PO had machined after exploding the original "cast" one.

With the advent of "winch" tightened halyards(all mine are led aft also) the adjustable downhaul is not req'd.(I have a "cunningham" also), but it does make removal simple!

 

[sleather]

Reconfigure?

I like the idea of rerigging the main sheet to the stern instead of over the companionway. From a leverage standpoint it would seems that it is a compromise to have the main sheet attached in the first 1/3 to 1/2 of the the length of the boom. Would there be a need for a traveler if the main sheet was mounted aft?
Thank you,
KJ

Kevin, If you reconfigured the existing mainsheet so that there was a turning block @ the MS led aft to the boom end,w/ another block lead down to a deck mounted block & cleat, the existing MS and traveler could remain as is.(hard to write a picture!!)It could even be double ended!

I never did understand "cabin top" mainsheets & travelers.
Aside from cleaning up the cockpit for cruising, they are hard to access while "solo" sailing. My mid cockpit traveler & mainsheet are "right there" 1' in front of the tiller(I cut my full-width traveler down to just the footwell, for better seating). The mainsheet does get in the way w/ many aboard, but that's the price you pay for a better handling rig.

With that "new main" of yours you do want a good traveler setup for "main" control(spilling air, in heavy air)
You could go w/ a transom mounted traveler, the main difference will be a "much" longer mainsheet, which can drastically affect "sail shape" in light air!(weight)
Alot of "non-performance" boats do it to clean up the cockpit. It's also behind you!

 

[Loren Beach]

Regarding the comments pro and con about housetop travelers on a 27...
Lots of good prior discussion on this site. Here's just one:
http://www.ericsonyachts.org/infoexchange/showthread.php?t=1914&referrerid=28

Loren

 

[Kevin Johnston]

Reconfiguration

Steve,
Your suggestions made sense to me. Having the mainsheet follow the boom to the stern with a pulley attached to the end of the boom, turning down to another pulley mounted to the transom and heading back up to the boom and tying off at that end of boom would create some really good mechanical advantage over the length of the boom. I'll consider that.

May have just doubled the length of the mainsheet I would guess or more. The traveler location has been good for me since I love being on the rail with a tiller extension. This configuration would get the job done without moving the traveler. Any one out there using a similar configuration?
Thanks,
KJ

 

[sleather]

May have just doubled the length of the mainsheet I would guess or more. The traveler location has been good for me since I love being on the rail with a tiller extension. This configuration would get the job done without moving the traveler. Any one out there using a similar configuration?
Thanks,
KJ

Duct tape some blocks to the boom as a mock-up & run your anchor line thru the blocks to get a length w/ the boom all the way out to the stays, it'll be a long one! You will be pulling alot more line when you trim.

You might want to"chime in" on the wheel vs tiller thang going on at Matt's 27 vs thread(#33). Perched on the rail or relaxing to leeward, a "hicking stick/tiller extension" gives you alot more mobility than a wheel.

 

[Kevin Johnston]

Carbon Fiber

Ballenger Spars in Santa Cruz can supply very nice replacement spars-not the same sections, but he knows the engineering specs for the E-boat spars and has very nice mast and boom sections which meet or beat the specs-at very fair prices.

Check 'em out!
S

I met up with Dave Eck, the general manager of Forte Carbon Fiber. Dave went out of his way to both pick up, package and coordinate with BAX Global to ship my new to me used boom. They produce spars (masts and booms) and are great people. They are based in Connecticut. You can find them on the web at
Forte Carbon Fiber
860-464-5221
www.fortecarbon.com

 

[Steve Swann]

My New E25 Boom from Ballenger is Here!

I took someone's recommendation from this site and ordered a new boom from Buzz Ballenger (buzzballenger@att.net) after I bent my OEM boom (remember, I said, "don't ask"). I just got it and it is BEAUTIFULLY DONE! I first thought it was expensive - until I got it and realized how well crafted it is. It also appears that all the weld-ups and dry-fitting of all the parts were done first. Then, the whole affair was disassembled and then the aluminum section was anodized then the fittings were re-attached. There is no bare aluminum on the entire assembly!

Buzz and his staff did a wonderful job for "Seahorse"!

 

[obiwanrazzy]

Loose or attached foot?

Kevin, Steve, Steve, et al,

Those of you that bent or broke your booms, was you main rigged with a loose foot or attached?

I ask, because my main (original I'm pretty sure) is attached to the boom. I was thinking of the possibilites of a main replacement as mine seems a bit blown out. At the very least, I can't get it flat enough for my liking. This could also be a factor of the excess friction of an attached foot along with no purchase on the outhaul (just one small block at the end and then cleated forward on the boom). Looking at replacements, I was wondering about a loose-footed main with the addition of a car or some sort of outhaul slide. BUT! Wouldn't that transfer load to the end of the boom, and what with my original mid-boom sheeting, do I run the risk of bending that little old thing? Any thoughts?

As you can see, the mind wanders as I sit in my living room dreaming of spring... I think I actually lost sleep over it last night.

 

[Kevin Johnston]

Matt,
My main was really blown out and was the original but one of the common failures on the E27 is the boom folding. I stayed with the foot attached to the boom and bought a much larger diameter boom to resolve a future failure. I would think loads would be similar if it were loose footed but maybe more concentrated at the outhaul so maybe that could increase the likelihood of stressing the boom. Anyone else with a different opinion.
KJ

FYI: Matt, I will be in Everett teaching a course early next month (Feb 7 & 8).

 

[Steve Swann]

Booms Away...

Matt,

I told you guys "don't ask" how I bent my OEM boom in an earlier post. OK, I'm coming clean here because Matt cleverly disguised his need to know...

I went to a loose-footed main and the sail shape is much nicer. In a nutshell, you should have gone back to sleep because, short of the winds of Katrina, there is no way that these small mainsails will generate enough torque and compression to bend your boom - unless you're dumb like me and bend yours while it is on the trailer with the mast horizontal. Read on.....

I bent my boom because I did two things very wrong when I was raising my mast using my boom as a gin pole. First, I attached to the aft-most bail instead of the very end of the boom with my block and tackle system. A big no-no here for a couple of reasons: There is also a substantial bolt hole through the boom at this point further weakening the extrusion and this location isn't at the end of the pole to generate maximum force. And secondly, I did not have my gooseneck all the way to the base of the mast for the most effective fulcrum point (read best position to generate the most power without compression the mast extrusion). Between the extra force of the fulcrum not being in the right place, and the weaker spot of just attaching to the ONE bail drilled through the boom extrusion 2' from the end of the boom, creating even more force on the boom, I bent the heck out of it and got the privilege to buy a new boom with more bells and whistles than I can figure out.

I'm gonna get gooder at doing this stuff eventually.

Hope this helps, Matt!

Steve Swann
E25 cb Seahorse

 

[Steve Swann]

25's must be a lot different

This is surprising about the 27s' booms. My 25 really had a stout extrusion. Perhaps it was overbuilt because it was also intended to be used for the mast raising affair. I can't remember my boom ever even flexing under any kind of load. But remember, the main on a 25 is pretty whimpy; the boat was really designed to be powered by the foresail component, I think.

I would be more worried about a gooseneck failure (I had a spare built and it sits in a drawer down below) than anything else.

If and when I ever decide to sell this boat, someone is going to get a prize.

Steve Swann
E25 cb Seahorse
Boise, ID

 

[obiwanrazzy]

Hm, maybe I shouldn't worry

Sounds like my little pet theory is blown (<- acceidental pun, I promise).

But, anyway this is how I was visualizing the forces involved (see attached). If I'm right, I would be loading the boom end and gooseneck if I went to loose footed. I guess I would have even more reason to consider changing the sheet to the end of the boom as well.

To be honest, my inclination is to just keep the rigging as close to original as possible. Change = expense.... But, it would be nice to have better control of the sail shape.. <SIGH>


p.s. Kevin, we should get together for a beer or something while you're in town!

 

[sleather]

Boom'ers think too much!

Matt, WOW:eek: when you think, YOU THINK! I concur on your design philosophy. Mid boom sheeting w/ a loose footed main would create "point loads" whereas a conventional bolt rope would distribute the loads more evenly. Just like in those "really-cool" sketches(yours?)

The loads on the E23 and ? are evened out because the mainsheet is located further aft on the boom(~1/3-2/3).What I wonder about is the vang loads(that's a common failure point)
My main has a bolt-rope w/ a "slide" at the clew and has what's called a "zipper-less shelf" which acts like a loose foot when tight and a conventional main when the outhaul is eased.

I'd recommend upgrading the out-haul system(major design deficiency on most boats) and keep asking around about the "foot-loose" thing.

Steve, by the time we learn everything we're too old to enjoy it. So what-da-hey a few screw-ups along the road of life keeps things interesting. NO PAIN..........NO GAIN!
Got me a "spare gooseneck" too!

BTW those sketches of leading the main aft are ? Like there's not enough stuff to trip over on the side deck? Just install a turning block on the cabin "top" and lead aft to a cleat. Install a "fairlead" behind the cleat @ the edge of the cabin and you can use unused jib winch and cleat to control the main "further aft".