Keel construction E32-2 - is it hollow aft of lead ballast?

[wesail&ubail]

My son and I are rebuilding a 32-2 that he bought for $1.00. The boat slipped its mooring and stove up on the rocks in Connecticut a handful of years ago. The dozen or so holes are now patched nicely but there seems to be a large hollow section aft of the lead ballast in the keel- is this normal? At various times throughout repairs tiny round lead shot would roll out from the gash in the bottom of the keel - I assumed that this was poured in over the top after the lead was set into the keel hollow, to bed the lead. The question is; was there a hollow section in the keel aft of the lead? Was it filled with shot? That would be a very large volume to re-fill. I assume if I leave it empty, it will inevitably fill with water and then freeze when we pull the boat each winter - causing a catastrophic blow out. Should we fill it with low expansion foam? Lead shot? There is a big difference for ballast effect here. Does anyone know how it was originally constructed? Thanks so much. Jay and Ebben

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[windjunkee]

as the happy owner of a 32-2, I can tell you the following story:

In 2007, we raced Voice of Reason to Puerto Vallarta Mexico. The return trip was made on the back of a flatbed truck. It was loaded onto the truck after we had already returned to the states. Apparently, when it was being loaded, the yard failed to lift the boat high enough for the flatbed to be backed underneath. The result was that about 1 1/2 inches of the stern part of the keel was shaved on. It opened the capsule and a bunch of the lead shot drained out. The yard elected not to tell us about it. Instead, they scooped up the lead shot and poured it behind the head. We STILL have lead shot rolling around the cabin.

When the boat arrived, in Redondo Beach, it was offloaded onto a cradle with much of the weight resting on the keel. The weakening of the keel caused the keel shell to split open like a pistachio nut. So, we saw the inside. There are long lead bars in there. They were not epoxied into place, they were loose inside the fiberglass capsule. I presume that prior to sealing up the keel from above, they poured the small lead shot around the bars to fill in the voids and prevent the lead bars from sliding around. i would say, from what i found rolling around, that there was maybe a third of a cubic yard of lead shot in there. i could be off because i don't know how much they left behind in Mexico.

hope that helps.

Jim McCone
Voice of Reason E-32-2 Hull #134
Redondo Beach, CA

 

[Alan Gomes]

Yikes!

as the happy owner of a 32-2, I can tell you the following story:

In 2007, we raced Voice of Reason to Puerto Vallarta Mexico. The return trip was made on the back of a flatbed truck. It was loaded onto the truck after we had already returned to the states. Apparently, when it was being loaded, the yard failed to lift the boat high enough for the flatbed to be backed underneath. The result was that about 1 1/2 inches of the stern part of the keel was shaved on. It opened the capsule and a bunch of the lead shot drained out. The yard elected not to tell us about it. Instead, they scooped up the lead shot and poured it behind the head. We STILL have lead shot rolling around the cabin.

When the boat arrived, in Redondo Beach, it was offloaded onto a cradle with much of the weight resting on the keel. The weakening of the keel caused the keel shell to split open like a pistachio nut. So, we saw the inside. There are long lead bars in there. They were not epoxied into place, they were loose inside the fiberglass capsule. I presume that prior to sealing up the keel from above, they poured the small lead shot around the bars to fill in the voids and prevent the lead bars from sliding around. i would say, from what i found rolling around, that there was maybe a third of a cubic yard of lead shot in there. i could be off because i don't know how much they left behind in Mexico.

hope that helps.

Jim McCone
Voice of Reason E-32-2 Hull #134
Redondo Beach, CA

Jim--How was this repaired? Just curious. By the way: I really like the name of your boat.

 

[toddster]

Interesting information. Is this typical of E-boats, I wonder? I had assumed there was a solid shape in there. As for the hollow - check the drawings for your boat. The large aft hollow in the E29 is shown in the drawings. (Really it's not that large, since that part of the keel is narrow.) It normally should remain dry.

There have been other threads, which may have been E29-specific, about adding extra ballast into the hollow section. I've heard that some other people have installed drain plugs, either there, or in the sump. (In part to prevent rain water accumulating on the hard.) And I've heard of people who suspect a keel-full of water simply drilling into it with a drill gun and patching the holes in the spring. FWIW, my hollow part was dry, despite a few dings.

 

[PDX]

FWIW the naval architect's drawing of the profile cross section shows three different sections in the keel area for the E32-2. http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=1165 I think this is curious. Usually keel areas (of embedded ballast type keels) are either lead (sold lead, ingots, or shot) or foam. If a third section for the E32-2 is hollow, I wonder what the objective was?

 

[toddster]

Though the shape is different, that drawing is similar to my boat, in that the three sections of the keel are 1. The bilge sump. 2. the ballast compartment and 3. A tapered hollow section aft of the ballast. Out of curiosity, I looked at the E32-2 manual, which has much more detailed drawings. However it sounds as if Windjunkie's boat did not exactly conform to those drawings. The manual shows, in the ballast section, a cast lead shape, shot filled in around it, "to bring weight to specification," then another large void filled with foam.

Now I'm really curious about what is actually inside my keel...

 

[BilgeRat]

Thank you for your responses! - I think we have it figured out.

Thanks for all of your replies. I didn't mean to not answer them.... something happened to our account so I re-registered and am now able to post again.

Our ballast is nicely formed lead that as some of you said, must have been placed inside the fiberglass keel and then tiny lead shot was poured around it. Thanks for pointing out they filled it to meet the weight specs. also to fill the bit of slop that must have been in the non fitting areas.

It sounds like the aft section may indeed have been foam filled so I will steer course to come to that end.

Thanks so much for your input one and all.

Jay and Ebben