E35-III: is 21HP enough?

[Canuck]

We (a couple) are looking for a boat to cruise the Bahamas and the Caribbean, and the Ericson 35-III is high on our short list. They tell me we will most likely be doing a lot of motoring (or motor-sailing), much of it upwind, to get from Miami to the BVI's. Most of our research seems to indicate that we need 1 HP for every 500 lbs of displacement. Another one we have heard (granted it was from a broker) was 1 HP per foot of LWL. Either one of these would suggest that the E35 needs 26-28HP. A number of owner reviews of the O'Day 35, which has 1400 lbs less displacement and the same 21HP Universal diesel as the E35, claim their boats are seriously underpowered, and will not motor into a chop. (I know some of that may have to do with hull shape and choice of propeller).

So, we really like the Eriscon, but we would like to get some feedback from E35-III owners on how their boats run under motor in real-world, ocean-going, 20 knot sloppy conditions that we are likely to encounter either headed to the BVI's or even here at home in Nova Scotia.

Any feedback would be very much appreciated. Thanks in advance!

John

 

[Loren Beach]

While horsepower per ton has been used for decades as a very general rule-of-thumb, there is also the shape of the underwater hull and the maximum beam (compared to LOA) and the general amount of wetted surface.
IMHO, and that's just me, I would say that the O'Day 34/35 needs a bit more horsepower because it has a fuller hull section forward and is generally less efficient beneath the water. That's not meant to be a slam on that design, either -- it is a *very* roomy boat inside for its length. That roominess does have its price...

The early 80's Universal in the Ericson's displacing around 10K # was a model M25, at 21 hp. By 1988, when Ericson constructed my Olson 34, that same engine was designated the M25XP and rated at 23 hp. I do not know what year Ericson made the change in their install schedule.

My boat displaces around 11K # in the real world, maybe more, and has enough power for banging into a short two foot chop in a confined channel. I can bump the revs from the usual cruising 2500 to 2900 and maintain 6 kts in a that chop. In smooth water I can motor at 6.8.

Sean's prior E-35-3 went cruising to Alaska and back. This is rough water country with big tide rips. My guess is that the stock diesel is enough.
Having said all that, if my faithful diesel ever croaks, I will replace it with the current version, rated at 27 hp.

Best,
Loren in PDX

ps: you are right about the prop having to be correct, too.

 

[escapade]

when is enough enough?

We have a 1988 E34 with the M25XP Universal (same as Loren's). We also find that a 6.8 KN cruiseing speed is the norm. As far as extended cruiseing into 20KN headwinds I think you will find that you will run out of fuel long before you reach your destination. Under heavy load you will probably burn about 1/2 gal/hr or about a 30 to max 40 hour range with standard tankage. We have found that motor sailing gives a much more comfortable ride and extends the range considerably. A lot depends on your itinerary. Will you be traveling to a long ago established time table that's rigid or will you be letting the weather factor into your travel's. Our friends have a Whitby 42 ketch that they cruise the Bahama's with in the winter month's. They have a 85 HP Perkin's yet they still let the weather control their travels.
What it boils down to is what are your expectations. If you are the type that has to move today regardless this isn't enough motor, IMHO. But if you are willing to plan your trip around the weather systems and use the motor for short beats (3 to 5 hours) to weather & anchoring and the like it will be plenty.
Have fun & sail fast
Bud E34 "Escapade"

 

[lbertran]

E 35-3 With Universal M25XP

We have this motor in our E35-3 and find that it pushes the boat very nicely. The E35-3 is a very efficient hull and moves well and fast through the water, under both sail and motor power. Sure, a stiff head wind will slow you down, but we've been able to make decent forward progress under these conditions.

Laura Bertran
Footloose, 1985 E35-3
Annapolis, MD

 

[FWQuinn]

When I hauled my 34 it weighed in at 17,000 lbs fully loaded. The 23 hp M25XP is not big enough for this size boat! I've recently changed from 2 blade to 3 blade fixed prop and it's better but still not enough. While I sail as much as possible, there are times when cruising you need to motor, especially in high winds and waves on the nose. I've been motoring in 30 plus headwinds & seas multiple times that have caused the boat to loose steering because the motor could not keep the boat going over 1 knot. This makes the boat unsuitable for cruising. I'll probably get a bigger boat with a bigger motor but if I were to keep this boat I would put a 30 hp Yanmar in it before heading out cruising.

 

[Morgan Stinemetz]

Hi,
It would seem, to me anyway, that motoring into big seas and 30-knot winds is an exercise in pain and discomfort. Would not the better course of action be to wait until thinngs calmed down? When one is cruising, the name of the game to wait until conditions favor a comfortable sail. I have been out there when I would have gladly gotten off the boat and let it sink, if my Fairy Godmother had been around to make it all happen.
The most weather I have been out in is 60-knot squall lines and sustained 36 with gusts to 42. We were anchored in the first, sailing in the second. Neither is something I would repeat any time soon.
Morgan Stinemetz

 

[Lew Decker]

Morgan is right. A little planning and a little patience go a long way. The stock E35 would be a great boat for poking around in the Caribbean, even with the 21hp, and if the trades ratchet into the no-comfort zone, it's a lot more fun to make up some rum punch and wait it out.

 

[Ernest]

Just one question.- Are you running at around 2400 RPM ? Can you reach 2800 at full throttle in gear? This may give you maybe 18-20 horsepower. If you are burning about 1 gal per hour, you are developing 18 HP. If you burn less, the prop diameter/pitch combo is wrong, and you are not getting the horses. Combo for your boat should be around 14/10.5 or 14/11 Ernie Schlesinger

 

[Ernest]

Sorry, I neglected to read all the prior posts. I see the subject was covered earlier. I too would like about a 30 HP engine but will live with our current 24 which is adequate 99% of the time.

 

[Canuck]

Thanks to everyone for all the great info. It certainly is our intention to let the weather determine our schedule, but weather changes, especially on 2-3 day passages, and having that margin of safety is comforting to newbie cruisers like us. So it is good to hear that power isn't generally a problem.

John.