E27--adding ballast?

[BobB]

The bow of my E27 rides high, so the water line is not even. When I bought my boat, the former owner had placed two 50 lb bags of sand in the foremost stowage beneath the quarter berth, I assume to compensate and adjust the boat's stance and trim. I removed the sand soon after that, but have wondered whether adding some lead ballast weights to the bow (quarter berth stowage) might improve performance by adjusting the boat's trim.

Anyone have any thoughts on adding ballast to adjust my boat's trim and keep its bow down? Is this common to E27s?

Thanks!

 

[timday5]

I have a freshwater storage tank up there, which is now empty except for a little bit of stagnant water left over from the prev owner's several years of neglect. I've been thinking of filling it up just to see if it helps the trim.

 

[rwthomas1]

FWIW, there is an approximately 3" difference in the waterline at the bow of my E38 depending on how full the 40 gallon forward water tank is. Sounds like a great place for a water tank in a E27.. RT

 

[BobB]

FWIW, there is an approximately 3" difference in the waterline at the bow of my E38 depending on how full the 40 gallon forward water tank is. Sounds like a great place for a water tank in a E27.. RT

Indeed it is! I have both my freshwater holding tank (25 gallons) and waste holding tank (30 gallon) under the quarter berth aft stowage space.

 

[Jeff Asbury]

I as well have both holding and fresh water tanks in the bow under the V berth. The holding is usually empty though. My E-27 rides a little high in the bow if my fresh water tank is low, about a inch or so. Can you post a photo so we can see how extreme your bow is riding up?

 

[BobB]

I as well have both holding and fresh water tanks in the bow under the V berth. The holding is usually empty though. My E-27 rides a little high in the bow if my fresh water tank is low, about a inch or so. Can you post a photo so we can see how extreme your bow is riding up?

Can do. Hopefully tomorrow or certainly on the weekend.

 

[BobB]

Can do. Hopefully tomorrow or certainly on the weekend.

Here's a recent photograph of my boat. If you look close, you can see that the waterline at the bow is about 3-4 inches above the water, while the stern is at water level.

 

[BobB]

Here's a recent photograph of my boat. If you look close, you can see that the waterline at the bow is about 3-4 inches above the water, while the stern is at water level.

Hi there,

So, is the waterline on my E27 bow up, or not?
Thanks.

 

[rwthomas1]

Certainly looks bow high in the pic. I guess it depends how picky you are regarding whether to "fix it" or not. RT

 

[Seth]

Wait!!!

Before you go adding weight that will only worsen your pitching moment and slow you down, let's see if you have too much weight in the back.....

Also, your concern is having the boat on its' lines while sailing-not sitting. If you do not have excess weight in the stern area, and with about 2 folks in the cockpit, check for stern dragging-you will notice that the stern section is below the water, you will hear a lot of noise from the turbulence of dragging the stern, and you may also not have a balanced helm (you may have lee helm). If you have any of these to a noticeable extent, then the bow may be riding too high.

OTPH, if the stern is not dragging more than an inch or so, is realtively quiet, and the helm is balanced, you are probably fine.

If you decide to retrim the boat, before adding any ballast, try and get whatver heavy stuff is stored in the back as far towards the middle of the boat as possible. Also, to the extent possible try and minimize the amount of weight in either end-keep the heavy stuff in the middle and the lighter gear in the bow and stern-to the extent possible.

As a last resort, if you simply must add weight forward, please do it via something like a water tank or something useful. The boat is plenty heavy, and adding 100 pounds without any benefit will be a net loss-in peformance and load carrying ability.

Enjoy!

S

 

[tanksalot]

Seth:

I don't disagree, but WHY does more weight slow you down?? I know racers want a lighter boat, but with more weight, the actual waterline is longer, and thus, to my understanding, the theoretical top speed is faster.

Tanksalot
Stan F.

 

[NateHanson]

Yes, the theoretical top speed is perhaps 0.02 knots faster, with a 1 inch longer waterline, but you'll have a harder time getting near that theoretical speed if your boat weighs 100 pounds more. The hull speed is not how fast you WILL go. It's how fast you CAN go if given all the power you need. But with more weight you'll need more power (wind, engine, whatever).

Basically carrying more weight to gain speed is a losing strategy.

 

[Guy Stevens]

Wetted Surface area, and coeficients of inertia

Your wetted surface area will go up a lot for 1" more of draft than the length on the water line will add to your wave configeration.

And adding weight will make it take more force to get you moving and make your object stay in motion....

Guy

 

[Seth]

Thanks Guys!

Beat me to it!

To keep things in very simple terms, think of this analogy: You have a car that weight 2K pounds with a 100 hp engine. Put that same engine in a 3K pound car and it will accelerate slower and have a lower top speed. Your sail plan IS you engine, and develops a given amount of power at a given windspeed. Weight affects speed potential for a sailboat the same way it does for a car or motorboat.

And, as was indicated already, that waterline is longer because more boat is displacing more water-and this is more surface area to push through the water-and that more than offsets the marginally longer WL...

Horse dead. I'm out.
S

 

[tanksalot]

Thanks for the responses!! The PO of my Ericson 27 added 300 (400?) lbs. of lead shot to the inside of the keel to improve stability. I'm not really a "racer", and my objection is partly the slight list to port at anchor, and also that it's not "right" (as in original design). But drilling out the epoxied-in lead shot is NOT high on my list of fun things to do.

Seth - Sorry about your horse.

Tanksalot
Stan F.

 

[joe-fran]

High bow

For what it's worth, my E27 sits the same as yours. If it ain't broke......

 

[Hobbster]

Water Line con't.

Ericson made the 27 in two models. One with an inboard motor and an outboard model. How did they handle the weight differance for these boats? My 27 is an inboard and has some lead in the bow. I always thoiught that this was to compensate for the inboard weight. Now I am replacing my old gas motor with an Yanmar. Not sure how my water line will react with the weight differance. What do you think?

 

[Jeff Asbury]

What size Yanmar are you installing?

Depending on what size Yanmar you put in, it may be lighter. I have a older Yanmar 8hp 1GM10 and it only weighs about 180 lbs. I am sure it's lighter than the 30 hp Atomic Four that was probably on the boat originally.

What size Yanmar are you installing? Personally I wish I had a little more power at times. Can't get a lot of headway when the winds on my nose at anything over 15 knots. It sure is economical though. I only burn about a quart of fuel an hour.

Great engines!

 

[Jeff Asbury]

For what it's worth here's a shot of my boat's water line. Take into account the boats secured with two mooring lines and the lines appear to be pretty tight because the tide may have come in.

 

[BobB]

For what it's worth here's a shot of my boat's water line. Take into account the boats secured with two mooring lines and the lines appear to be pretty tight because the tide may have come in.

Well dang it! I've read each and every one of your comments and arguments, and I'm still unsure if adding additional weight to my bow will improve its _overall_ performance. And I thought sailing was simple... lol. Anyhow, thanks for the wonderful enlightening (if somewhat confusing) discussion. After a lot of thought, I think I'll just go sailing and worry about the waterline some winter's day.

Cheers!