Chart plotter location options

[nquigley]

I’m about to add a chart plotter - likely the B&G Vulcan 9” model (not totally decided yet).
I’ll also add an AIS transponder, connected via NMEA 2000. My wind and depth inputs go to existing displays in the cockpit, which won’t be in the NMEA system.
The plotter will mirror to a tablet, phone, laptop via Wi-Fi.

I’m trying to understand the pros and cons of having the plotter at the helm, mirrored to other devices down below, vs installing the plotter at the nav station, mirroring to an iPad (in a waterproof cover) at the helm.
Please give me your thoughts on these two options.

 

[Marlin Prowell]

I have a Garmin 942xs chart plotter in a NavPod on the binnacle guard. It has WiFi built in, so I can mirror the Garmin display to my iPad and iPhone. I like this arrangement. Chart plotters are designed to be in harsh environments, including being in the sun all day. iPads are not designed to be baked by the sun and will shut off if they get too hot. I’ve had sailors who use iPads tell me they cannot keep the iPad always out in the sunlight because of this. Putting an iPad in a waterproof case might make it heat up faster.

The downside to my arrangement is that cabling can be more challenging. You need to run a power/data cable and a NMEA2000 cable up the inside of the binnacle guard.

 

[nquigley]

Thanks, Marlin. Good points. Even though I leave my bimini up all the time, I take the point about the iPad overheating. Also, keeping it powered/charged over a number of hours would be a challenge.
I’m learning about NMEA2000 - I thought it can bring power to a unit and carry data too but you had to run 2 cables. Did you consider putting a waterproof gland in the cockpit sole near the binacle guard, and run cables up the outside of the guard? Not too elegant, but tons easier?
Thanks
Neil

 

[Prairie Schooner]

Howdy,
Below are some threads which include discussions about plotter/repeater pad locations. Forgive me if you've already seen them.

E35/3 Chart plotters at the helm?

Hi Everyone, I'm wondering what other E35/3 owners have done to install a chart plotter at the helm? My son is a long way up the coast of BC, and our current (older) plotter has decided to quit. He's now navigating using paper charts and Navionics on a couple of iPhones. My wife and I will...

ericsonyachts.org

These are some other links that have been helpful:
- https://ericsonyachts.org/ie/threads/do-you-like-your-helm-configuration-please-share.17370/
- https://ericsonyachts.org/ie/ubs/navpod-instrument-enclosure-and-pedestal-guard.765/
- https://ericsonyachts.org/ie/threads/ais-vhf-plotter-question.20130/

I did some testing with plotter location and compass interference detailed in post #38 here:
- https://ericsonyachts.org/ie/threads/radar-yes-maybe-no-advice.21006/

We'll almost certainly have the tablet at the nav desk because it'd be harder to weatherize, charge, and see at the helm. Also, I like the idea of having physical knobs and buttons as well as touch screen when I'm at the helm. But folks who do it the other way like that.
Jeff

 

[nquigley]

Thanks for pulling all those resources together in one post!!
It looks like there are no hard 'rules' to follow here - gonna have to think hard about how I really will be using the plotter and the other mirrored screens the majority of the time, and set it all up to meet that need, and then adapt for the rare alternate use.

 

[Christian Williams]

It might be useful to take a sail dedicated to the actual study of usage. Our environments are all different as are our typical daysails and voyages. Some of us usually have family crews with somebody always at the helm and and some are shorthanded with reliance on self-steering. Some sailing areas demand close attention to AIS or radar and prioritize that.

Some of us demand a lot of data and savor mirrors and slaves and wires up the kazoo, others are fine with a Windex.

Simplest that works is right for us all, and varies with us all. It takes objective testing to recognize our actual needs, and the results can be surprising. .

(By the way, it's fairly easy to run wires inside a binnacle guard. Drilling big holes in stainless tubing is doable in place, and many cables can be spliced despite dire manufacturer warnings not to. I have chartplotter and wheel pilot readout and motor wires all inside one 1" guard tube.)

 

[jtsai]

I have a decade-old Raymarine chart plotter in a NavPod on the binnacle guard that echos depth reading. The chart plotter has logged 1,200 nm miles traveled along the southeast coast of the US. The secondary device is an iPad with Navionic app. It is used when detailed navigation information is needed. I loaded Navionic chip on the chart plotter during the Chesapeake trip but found the iPad has better screen resolution and easier to zoom in/out than the old chart plotter. I am sure the newer chart plotter models have improved a lot.

Even with the dodger and bimini, the iPad did shutdown several times due to the heat. Also, the iPad has the bad habit of losing the GPS signal when traveling at very low speed, like when dodging tugs in a narrow ICW and needs to know how far to move out without grounding. The chart plotter never loses the GPS signal even without an external GPS antenna.

There were two occasions when I was extremely glad I had a dedicated chart plotter on the binnacle. Both were white out conditions when dodger/bimini offered no protection from the driving rain, the chart plotter was soaking wet and navigation was critical to maintaining the course. Those are the days I forgive Raymarine for the ridiculously price and even more ridiculous user manual.

 

[Marlin Prowell]

When we bought our Ericson, it had ancient instruments, some of which did not work. This was a feature, as I wanted to replace everything with a modern chart plotter and instruments, all interconnected with NMEA 2000. Here is our current helm. Everything is displayable on the chart plotter.

NMEA bus power​

The NMEA 2000 bus can supply a small amount of power to each device. In our case, the Raymarine autopilot control head can get enough power from the NMEA 2000 bus and so has only the NMEA 2000 cable attached to it which goes down the binnacle tube. The Garmin chart plotter needs more than what the bus can provide, so it has two cables - one for power and the other is the NMEA 2000 data cable. There is also an autopilot motor cable and remote mic cable inside the 1" binnacle tubes.

I preferred to run the cables inside the binnacle tubes rather than use a waterproof gland. It wasn't much harder, the cables won't get accidentally snagged, and you still have the same wiring to do underneath the cockpit sole.

Chart plotter magnets​

The Garmin 942xs above has a magnet on the small door in the lower right corner for accessing the SD cards. It's pretty invisible in this lower resolution photo. I deliberately installed the chart plotter on the left side of the NavPod so the magnet would be directly above the binnacle compass. I did some testing and the magnet has a negligible affect on the binnacle compass in that location. When I swapped the autopilot control head and chart plotter locations, putting the chart plotter on the right, the magnet had a noticeable effect on the compass.

Our chart plotter is about five years old. The current Garmin model, 943xsv, no longer has a door for SD cards on the front on the chart plotter. The SD card slots are now on the back of the device, and a rectangular rubber plug securely seals the SD cards. There is no magnet. If we had a 943xsv in the NavPod, we would no longer be able to access the SD cards without disassembling the NavPod. For us, that is not a problem. We have done software updates over the chart plotter's WiFi network and have not needed to physically access the SD cards for years. I don't know what other chart plotter manufacturers have migrated away from using magnets, but you should check the specific device you are considering. The rule that manufacturer X always uses magnets no longer applies.

AIS transponder​

We have an AIS transponder and we love it. We have a lot of tanker traffic, cargo ships, and ferry boats in our area and it lets us see them in advance. We have a VesperMate XB8000, but unfortunately they have been discontinued. I don't know what AIS transponder I would select these days.

 

[p.gazibara]

Is your boat tiller or wheel steered? I used to work at Navico doing SW testing, so I am a bit familiar with their line of MFDs. I mounted a 7" Zeus3 in the bulkhead on Cinderella which is easy to see and didn't make a huge hole in the bulkhead, but with the tiller I am right next to the bulkhead when steering, unless the extention is used and I'm steering from the rail. I am also using the NRS-2 AIS enabled VHF, which works well to give AIS targets on the MFD. Any N2K enabled AIS device on the N2K bus will send AIS packet data to the MFD. The V60B or the RS40B are both AIS transcievers and the non-B versionsof those radios (v60, RS40) will receive AIS, so those would be options if you wanted a standard VHF from Navico that could also pipe AIS data to the N2K bus.

A word of caution with the nav pod boxes - MFDs can get hot, putting them in a fiberglass box and letting them sit in the sun is sure to give degraded performance in the dead of summer. They will work, but the CPUs get throttled at some point to prevent overheating. The MFDs themselves are fully waterproof and we tested them by dunkning in saltwater tanks at Navico. I even found one in the ewaste bin that had water inside of it due to physical damage (case cracked) I powered it up and it still worked! I couldn't believe it, anyway I would lean towards leaving it outside of a pod box if you do place it at the binnacle (unless theft is a big issue). If you end up with a Navico autopilot, the MFD can be the controller for it as well, so you wouldn't need to mount an extra pilot control head at the binnace.

I would also be hesitant to rely on the WIFI repeater to a phone/tablet regardless of brand. It was something that we had lots of bugs in, sure helped sell the products though. Maybe they have it sorted now?

The Vulcan is BnG's low end plotter, without physical buttons to press/D pad to scroll, you may find the touch screen doesn't respond well to your finger touch when wet or cold. This is a limitation to all touch screen products and worth considering when mounting in the cockpit.

Hope that helps a bit. As a plotter, the Vulcan is a bit slow by modern standards, but does the job. It runs Navico's decade old linux based OS vs the new plotters (by all manufactures) that are running on the Android platform.

Hope that helps a bit.

 

[Tooluser]

I don't know what AIS transponder I would select these days.

I don't have one yet, but these look super cool:

MAIANA AIS Transponder — OpenPlotter 3 documentation

 

[p.gazibara]

I don't have one yet, but these look super cool:

MAIANA AIS Transponder — OpenPlotter 3 documentation

This is fantastic! I would have gone this route no doubt if we didn't have a solid VHF with AIS. It kind of mentions transmit? I wonder how they get around the legal stuff of not being able to reset your MMSI on the fly (anit-piracy).

 

[dhill]

The previous owner of my boat installed the Raymarine a65 7" chart plotter on an adjustable arm on the starboard side of the binnacle guard. I find it to be a very convenient place to have the plotter, since it can be rotated around so that I can run the boat from the stern seating or from the starboard side in the cockpit, which works well on starboard tack. The cables run through a hole in the binnacle guard.





@Bolo mentioned a tool in the Tool Review thread that looks useful for drilling holes in stainless steel pipes, which is normally notoriously difficult.

Good luck!
Dave

 

[Bolo]

I’m about to add a chart plotter - likely the B&G Vulcan 9” model (not totally decided yet).
I’ll also add an AIS transponder, connected via NMEA 2000. My wind and depth inputs go to existing displays in the cockpit, which won’t be in the NMEA system.
The plotter will mirror to a tablet, phone, laptop via Wi-Fi.

I’m trying to understand the pros and cons of having the plotter at the helm, mirrored to other devices down below, vs installing the plotter at the nav station, mirroring to an iPad (in a waterproof cover) at the helm.
Please give me your thoughts on these two options.

Your posting caught my eye because I have an E32-3 hull #722 so maybe your binnacle is similar to mine. I upgraded most of the instruments to Raymarine including a new, larger, chart plotter. with the sailing I do, on the Chesapeake Bay, I find that having a chart plotter at the binnacle is more useful…to me. As for where the put the thing without to many modifications to the binnacle, check out my YouTube video.

 

[Michael Edwards]

Hey folks,
I just wanted to chime in, On our E-32, the mainsheet discourages mounting anything to the binnacle.
I made a fiberglass recess, installed it on the cabin bulkhead. The instrument is recessed. Its covered by Sunbrella.
Occasionally , snaking through our channel we ask the person blocking our view to lean back bit. On the interior there is a cabinet, so it is a neat installation.

 

[Pete the Cat]

I have a cheap Raymarine plotter (a Dragonfly) at the helm and a better Garmin plotter with current and tide info integrated-- linked to AIS at the chart table. I do a fair amount of route planning through the islands and passages in Maine and need a good plotter where I am doing the planning--which I do while sitting at the chart table, not at the helm. On the other hand, I like to know that I am navigating correctly when I am shooting the passages at the helm. I vote for having both. I also would note that you could use your iphone for navigation at the helm with iNavx if you only have one good chartplotter. I have friends who do this and it makes sense to me. The chip in your iphone is probably more capable than most of the chartplotters on the market. And you can move it around the boat as you move to ensure you are on track. I also use Ipads.

 

[nquigley]

AIS & Chart plotter installation done:
I finished this project today: Vesper Cortex M1 AIS / B&G Vulcan 9 plotter, on an NMEA network. Both units can be mirrored on a phone and a tablet. The plotter also allows the AIS targets to be displayed on it, and any mirrored devices. I will eventually get PredictWind data fed to the plotter.
I’ll mirror to display to an iPad and/or iPhone at the helm.

 

[Tooluser]

Looks great!

 

[toddster]

I started out like that, 18 months ago, with a Zeus3s9 at the nav station and an ipad mounted at the helm, for full-time cruising. My experience:
The B&G app is cranky and buggy. Sometimes remote control works, sometimes it doesn't.
A daily occurrence, usually at crucial moments, like trying to get out of the way of an oil tanker in skinny water, in the dark, the iPad flashes out, "connection lost" and goes blank. The only way to get it back is to reboot both the ipad and the MFD, which takes several minutes, when you only have seconds. The iPad is also more susceptible to blacking out from overheating than a MFD, though both could use a little shade screen.

Eventually I bit the bullet and got a second MFD to mount at the helm. Too many potentially life-threatening situations arose.

YMMV

 

[nquigley]

If iPad at the helm loses the plot mirroring the below-deck plotter, can you quickly open a Navionics chart that’s already set up on the iPad as the primary back-up?
Do you also have your phone at the helm as another mirror (or already running Navionics)?

 

[toddster]

Have not tried mirroring to two devices at once. I suppose the result would depend on which device is experiencing the initial bug.

Oh, also the iPad would not charge through the 12V adapter available at the helm. I had to run a 110VAC extension cord into the cockpit from the inverter to keep it powered up all day. Not a good thing.

As backup, I kept a paper chart at hand, on the chart table, where it could be snatched up quickly. Of course this works best if you actually maintain a pencil plot of where you are. And have something better than small scale charts in a chartbook. Haven't done that in months... On passage, I keep notes in the log book, so I could reconstruct a DR plot, if necessary, given time.