This sailing season I've noticed a slight odor coming from my Universal M25XP on my 1988 E -32-200 when it has been running for a fair amount of time (45 minutes or more). Initially I thought it was coming from the breather hose but was not really concerned since it was a fairly faint odor. This weekend it became strong, to the point of almost overwhelming and there appeared to be a light haze (smoke) in the cabin. At first I thought I had cooked my alternator since the smell almost had an "electrical" odor but I'm still reading 13.7 volts output on the alternator. Today the odor smelled more like burning oil. The engine has been running at about 175 degrees at about 2200 RPM. I believe this is a normal temperature, correct? I pulled the engine cover when the engine was running and could not pinpoint the source of the smell. It's definitely coming from the engine someplace. I'm not losing oil as far as I can tell. Any suggestions on what this might be or things I could check?
Frank Langer
1984 Ericson 30+, Nanaimo, BC
Hi,
The possibility of slight smoke/haze and a burning smell makes me think of an oil leak, or burning off spilled oil from a recent oil change if you did one. But that doesn't explain the "electrical" nature of the smell that you thought you detected. Have you done a careful check of all wiring to ensure none feels hot, or is touching the hot engine. Are all connections tight?
I'm no real mechanic, so others may have better ideas. I hope you get it solved soon. Let us know if you do.
Frank
The possibility of slight smoke/haze and a burning smell makes me think of an oil leak, or burning off spilled oil from a recent oil change if you did one. But that doesn't explain the "electrical" nature of the smell that you thought you detected. Have you done a careful check of all wiring to ensure none feels hot, or is touching the hot engine. Are all connections tight?
I'm no real mechanic, so others may have better ideas. I hope you get it solved soon. Let us know if you do.
Frank
u079721
Contributing Partner
I vote for blow-by from the crankcase breather tube, though I've no explanation as to why it just got worse.
Why not try the modification in which you route the breather hose back into the air intake? If this is blow-by the mod will fix things right away. If not you're out maybe $5 for an elbow and some longer hose.
Why not try the modification in which you route the breather hose back into the air intake? If this is blow-by the mod will fix things right away. If not you're out maybe $5 for an elbow and some longer hose.
Engine room smell.
Brian, Without being able to tell you exactly what you might be smelling in your engine room, might I suggest that you eliminate as many sources as possible? Frank's suggestion that it might be oil related is a good place to start and another that comes to mind is the small of a loose belt. A slightly loose belt can impart an offensive odor and one even looser can create a dust that at first glance looks a lot like smoke. The difference is that the dust will land on everything in the engine room and is a real pain to clean up. So take the time to do some detective work by eliminating as many possible sources as you can. By cleaning the engine, you'll develop a fuller understanding of it, like where things are etc, and the same holds true for checking and tightening the belts. Who knows, you might even find an unrelated issue to deal with that wouldn't have surfaced otherwise. Good luck, Glyn Judson, E31 hull #55, Marina del Rey, CA
Brian, Without being able to tell you exactly what you might be smelling in your engine room, might I suggest that you eliminate as many sources as possible? Frank's suggestion that it might be oil related is a good place to start and another that comes to mind is the small of a loose belt. A slightly loose belt can impart an offensive odor and one even looser can create a dust that at first glance looks a lot like smoke. The difference is that the dust will land on everything in the engine room and is a real pain to clean up. So take the time to do some detective work by eliminating as many possible sources as you can. By cleaning the engine, you'll develop a fuller understanding of it, like where things are etc, and the same holds true for checking and tightening the belts. Who knows, you might even find an unrelated issue to deal with that wouldn't have surfaced otherwise. Good luck, Glyn Judson, E31 hull #55, Marina del Rey, CA
Another few thoughts.
Brian, Just as I hit the Submit button, I thought of another thing or tow to look for, a sticking or sluggish fan belt pulley being one. Rotate the engine as best as you can by hand and/or loosen the belt(s) to check for free movement of the pulleys, all but the crankshaft of course. Then start the engine to listen and look for any belt squealing or even just a bit of telltale "smoke". For that matter, after eliminating the above, use the beam of a small flashlight in the darkened engine room to penetrate any smoke that might be forming and try to track down it's source. Check to see that the dip stick is firmly in place and that the rubber seal isn't allowing any blow by to escape. Check the oil fill cap too as well as any rebreather hose or fittings for blow by. Glyn
Brian, Just as I hit the Submit button, I thought of another thing or tow to look for, a sticking or sluggish fan belt pulley being one. Rotate the engine as best as you can by hand and/or loosen the belt(s) to check for free movement of the pulleys, all but the crankshaft of course. Then start the engine to listen and look for any belt squealing or even just a bit of telltale "smoke". For that matter, after eliminating the above, use the beam of a small flashlight in the darkened engine room to penetrate any smoke that might be forming and try to track down it's source. Check to see that the dip stick is firmly in place and that the rubber seal isn't allowing any blow by to escape. Check the oil fill cap too as well as any rebreather hose or fittings for blow by. Glyn
I will probably route the crankcase vent tube into the air filter. I've seen a write-up on that and it was one of those "someday" projects.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com
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The oil was changed last fall after haul out and I can not see any leakage or dripping anywhere.<o></o>
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I did check the belt and it looks fine, but I'll check it very closely again. I check both the oil level and the belt and do a cursory check of the engine everyday before starting the engine.<o></o>
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It's nearly impossible to check all the wiring, but what I can see looks fine and is not overheated. I'm really thinking this is more engine or exhaust odor than electrical.<o></o>
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Overall, the engine is very clean and has been well cared for.<o></o>
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Now, about the water flow, how much is enough? There is definitely water spraying out with the exhaust but it's not a steady stream like you'd get out of a garden hose. My engine was running about 175 degrees. I have a new temperature gauge this year and it's been running the same temp most of the year. I can't remember what it ran with the prior gauge.<o></o>
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Glyn, about your 2nd post, I've done everything you suggested except for the flashlight in the dark.<o></o>
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I'm really thinking it's a heat exchanger or exhaust system problem. Would an exhaust leak smell the same as the exhaust coming out of the exhaust outlet? My assumption is that it would smell the same and this does not. And, if it is oil burning someplace, where the heck would it be burning? UGH!<o></o>
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></o>The oil was changed last fall after haul out and I can not see any leakage or dripping anywhere.<o
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></o>I did check the belt and it looks fine, but I'll check it very closely again. I check both the oil level and the belt and do a cursory check of the engine everyday before starting the engine.<o
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></o>It's nearly impossible to check all the wiring, but what I can see looks fine and is not overheated. I'm really thinking this is more engine or exhaust odor than electrical.<o
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></o>Overall, the engine is very clean and has been well cared for.<o
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></o>Now, about the water flow, how much is enough? There is definitely water spraying out with the exhaust but it's not a steady stream like you'd get out of a garden hose. My engine was running about 175 degrees. I have a new temperature gauge this year and it's been running the same temp most of the year. I can't remember what it ran with the prior gauge.<o
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></o>Glyn, about your 2nd post, I've done everything you suggested except for the flashlight in the dark.<o
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></o>I'm really thinking it's a heat exchanger or exhaust system problem. Would an exhaust leak smell the same as the exhaust coming out of the exhaust outlet? My assumption is that it would smell the same and this does not. And, if it is oil burning someplace, where the heck would it be burning? UGH!<o
></o>I just happen to have (don't ask why, please) a picture of the water flow on my prior engine, a Yanmar 2QM15. About every 4-5 seconds it would go from a trickle to a nice solid gush as pictured here:
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Whoa David, that's a gusher! No, I'm not seeing anything like that. Mine is more regular and I would call the volume low. I'm not sure what kind of exhaust pipe I have. I do know that beyond the engine someplace it becomes rubber hose. I'm not sure how to determine what's between the engine and the rubber. I guess I need to do some searching to find out. I think I'll also replace the raw water hose from the intake to the water pump. I'm thinking you have me on the right track, low water flow.
I just helped a friend go through an exhaust problem. Our first tip off to a restriction in the exhaust was a ton of water pushing out the siphon break. It turned out to be a combination of restriction in the mixing elbow and the exhaust line from the mixing elbow to the water lift (Vetus) was collapsed internally. Of course, first thing to check is your water pump impeller and that the suction side isn't clogged with some debris. When I first bought Emerald, she had sat quite awhile, and the intake through hull was fully clogged. I cleared it by hooking the bellows pump for the Avon to the line (pump above water line), and gave it a nice firm push and blew the line clear. Hope I'm not sending you down the wrong path, but if your water flow is low, I think it's worth checking through.
Frank Langer
1984 Ericson 30+, Nanaimo, BC
Brian,
Boats vary quite alot in how much water they exhaust and under how much pressure. If you watch in the marina, you will see that--depending on engine type, size, size of exhaust hoses, etc. Our universal 16 hp motor doesn't exhaust like David's--it's more of a regular sputter, yet our engine doesn't smell and works fine.
Frank
Boats vary quite alot in how much water they exhaust and under how much pressure. If you watch in the marina, you will see that--depending on engine type, size, size of exhaust hoses, etc. Our universal 16 hp motor doesn't exhaust like David's--it's more of a regular sputter, yet our engine doesn't smell and works fine.
Frank
WBurgner
Member III
Are you familiar with the smell of heated/burned coolant? It is not the acrid smell of hot rubber or wire insulation. It is almost sweet, but not in a pleasant way. I have had a genset spray a fine jet of coolant on the exhaust riser which filled the engine compartment and lockers with a smoke like fog and strong odor. Thought we were on fire at first.
While checking things out you might look for evidence of such a leak around the exhaust manifold.
While checking things out you might look for evidence of such a leak around the exhaust manifold.
WBurgner's advice is good, and if it is AF, you should also notice the level reducing slightly as the engine is run. He also pointed out that the water output from his exhaust is steady - an indication there are no 'valleys' in his wet exhaust section that causes water to collect and then batch out in bursts. I don't know about deisels, but with A4, valley's and the resulting batching wreak havoc, causing fouled plugs, overheating, and possibly the acrid smell if blowby is allowed to escape through whatever opening it can sneak past (oil cap, backfire preventer, etc). Might be worth checking for valleys in your wet exhaust, and if you have any, try to make the wet exhaust section a steady downward slope to the thru-hull from the highest point in your exhaust riser.
I have the same model diesel and we always had some "oily odor" in the cabin until I re-routed the blowby hose to the side the air intake.
One of these days I do intend to follow the excellent guide published by Mainesail and upgrade to a K&N filter with that hose led directly into it.
Also, we always run the exhaust blower any time the engine is running... And, the intake for the blower hose is mounted high up in the confined engine compartment near the alternator to try and draw some hot air away from it.
Loren
One of these days I do intend to follow the excellent guide published by Mainesail and upgrade to a K&N filter with that hose led directly into it.
Also, we always run the exhaust blower any time the engine is running... And, the intake for the blower hose is mounted high up in the confined engine compartment near the alternator to try and draw some hot air away from it.
Loren
"Boats vary quite alot in how much water they exhaust and under how much pressure."
Reminds me of a time when motoring into the Harbor after a Wednesday evening beer can race (lots of boats). A person on a boat behind me called out with some alarm, "there is no exhaust water coming out of your transom." I replied that I have an electric inboard. After a brief confused look they gave me a big thumbs up.
Reminds me of a time when motoring into the Harbor after a Wednesday evening beer can race (lots of boats). A person on a boat behind me called out with some alarm, "there is no exhaust water coming out of your transom." I replied that I have an electric inboard. After a brief confused look they gave me a big thumbs up.
Bill, yes I am familiar with the smell of burning antifreeze and it's not that. The AF level has remained constant also. My real concern at this point is making sure the exhaust system is not overheating and to find out if I have a Vetus plastic exhaust.
Loren I did replace my stock air intake with a K&N last winter, but did not run the crankcase vent hose into it. Looks like now is a good time to do that. It may be a good time to install a CO detector also.
Can anyone tell me if my 1988 E-32-200 with the Universal M25XP has the Vetus and how to access the muffler?
Loren I did replace my stock air intake with a K&N last winter, but did not run the crankcase vent hose into it. Looks like now is a good time to do that. It may be a good time to install a CO detector also.
Can anyone tell me if my 1988 E-32-200 with the Universal M25XP has the Vetus and how to access the muffler?
Just for reference, I don't have any excessive dip in my system, and am using a Vernalift from Centek installed almost exactly as you see here - downward run to the waterlift and then a rise above the waterline, in my case about the height of the cockpit sole, and then down to the exit above the water line. Here's a link to a page of the installation diagram that is almost a dead ringer for what I have:
http://www.centekindustries.com/vernaliftfig2.html
Follow your exhaust hose aft from your mixing elbow and you'll ultimately hit your water lift. It could be a Vetus or other manufacture - no rhyme or reason on this. My original one from Ericson was a cast iron critter.
http://www.centekindustries.com/vernaliftfig2.html
Follow your exhaust hose aft from your mixing elbow and you'll ultimately hit your water lift. It could be a Vetus or other manufacture - no rhyme or reason on this. My original one from Ericson was a cast iron critter.
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