Opinions Wanted - Gutting and Restoring a Trailer Sailor

[hcpookie]

The title says it all. I have a lead on a 22' trailered boat that has sat for the last 10 years beside a barn in Ohio and has not been maintained. It needs to have a complete refurbish inside - new wood, new cabinets, the whole nine yards.

I am told it is a 1980-era 22' Bayliner and structurally it is sound. There is water standing in the cabin, and all the lines are (obviously) in need of replacement.

All of the hardware and the hull are sound, I am told, and the outside needs only a pressure wash.

The outboard hasn't been started in years and therefore probably doesn't run.

It is about a 400 mile trip for me to go pick it up. The tires probably need to be replaced, at least to be aired up, and of course the bearings would need to be repacked. I'm not sure on the trailer lights. I'd make it a weekend trip to pick it up later this year and get the trailer completely road-ready to haul it back.

I have permission from the First Mate to park this in the back of our back yard, behind the garden and in the trees while I rebuild it, if I so choose. I figure that I could rebuild it one piece at a time, one cabinet here, one hatch there, etc. on the weekends or evenings during the off season until she is ready for launch.


Here's the hook - the current owner wants to give it away for free. Thoughts?

 

[Loren Beach]

Was this one of the later Doug Petersen (sp) designed fin keel racer-cruisers?
They were quite a different (and much better looking / performing) boat than the early Bayliner Buccaneers that were and are the butt of well-deserved jokes. The one I am thinking of was part of design series of molds that Bayliner bought second hand and produced/sold as "US Yachts."

The later 22, 25, and 27 were both very similar designs - same design family.
Here is one listed at Yachtworld:
http://www.yachtworld.com/core/list...rency=USD&access=Public&listing_id=22904&url=

Good luck,
Loren in PDX

ps: "free" is perhaps appropriate, but, what's your time worth?

 

[hcpookie]

That one for sale looks the same model as this one. Thanks for the link! Here's a smaller pic of this one I'm looking at:

 

[Sean Engle]

The title says it all - the current owner wants to give it away for free. Thoughts?

On the post: I uploaded your images for you - you probably ran into a problem because they needed to be resized...

On the boat: I think Loren is right - you are overlooking the value of your time. Even if you overhaul this thing to pristine condition - it will still be a Bayliner - and you'll still have put more into it than it's worth (unless you have something for this model, etc).

Has your wife see these photos - does she have a clear understanding of what kind of fixture you're envisioning in your yard?

I would seriously consider a pass - unless this were an Ericson... :nerd:

Just my $0.02...

//sse

 

[Emerald]

I've got to agree with Sean on this. It's not a special boat. You are taking out the trash for someone 400 miles away. If you really want a project boat, I am sure you can find one in the area you live. I have passed on two "free" 22 foot sailboats over the past year because close inspection revealed that the were "free" for a reason. Looking at the picture you posted of the bulkhead and chain plates, there appears to be water damage, and I would guess you will replace the bulkhead before you are done, which means there are structural issues on this boat. Besides, unless something's happened, you've got a pretty nice E-27 to work on making perfect

 

[Rob Hessenius]

Its a Duck

I have to agree with the rest of the guys. I think even though its a free boat and you dont charge yourself for your time, You will spend way more than you will ever give the boat away for. There are oodles of this same situational boats spread across this great country. I know everything doesnt have to come down to money and I would say go-for-it on a better brand of boat. If Bayliner was not laughed at by most all, it would be a different story. With you asking, I kinda think in the back of your mind that you know its foolish, or not practical.

The bottom line is If it walks like a duck, sounds like a duck, Its a DUCK.

Rob Hessenius

 

[hcpookie]

Thanks, guys. I wasn't sure if this was a worthy "spare time" project or not. I had half a mind to get the 16-yr old involved as "his" boat to fix up. Figured it would be a good bonding project, but sounds like this isn't really worth the effort at any cost.

I like the idea of having it parked in the back yard, since I wouldn't have to figure a way to squeeze time away from the yard work and stuff... but no matter.

 

[Loren Beach]

Tough decision...
I do understand the attraction of getting a free and restorable boat. I have thought of doing something like this, if and when I ever "get a round tuit."

Off hand, I think that I would want to put my time into a "classic" like an Ericson 23, a Ranger Yachts 23, Santanna 22, or maybe even a Cal 20...

Still, no matter what boat is chosen, the time invested would have to be amortized out in sailing time with no expectation of generating any real $ return upon resale someday.
Basically you acquire it for free, and then have to budget for insurance, repairs and upgrades, and transportation. If it looks real nice later on when you sell it, you get back 1K or 2K, and have to write off about 5K in "undeclared labor and parts" costs. Before I retired I used boat projects as therapy to offset a rather stressful job -- nowadays I find that I enjoy the boat projects a bit less than I used to...


You are probably younger than I and do not have to face the problem of "calendar compression" until you enter middle age.

Whatever your decision, keep us posted. As Red Green sez: "We're all pullin' for ya!"

Loren

 

[Shadowfax]

< I am told it is a 1980-era 22' Bayliner and structurally it is sound.>

I'm sorry, I can't resist, but can you even use "Bayliner" and "structurally sound" in the same sentence?

I'm kidding, please don't take personally, but I agree with the others; all that work and money and what do you have when you are done... ?

 

[paul culver]

The sink looks good.

--Paul

 

[Randy Rutledge]

How much do sails cost for this boat?

 

[Guy Stevens]

Those little marks on the side of the boat.

You see those little black marks on the side of the boat, just above the waterline.... Look closer they are there, maybe the camera didn't record them really well..... Keep looking......


Those are ten foot pole marks.....

As in I wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole.

Guy

 

[Sean Engle]

...You are probably younger than I...

We're all younger than you, Loren!

//sse

 

[hcpookie]

Thanks for all that input! "I'll pass"... it is free, but nothing really is "free" is it?

My first thoughts were that this would be a great stepfather-stepson bonding experience. The lure would be that this 16 year old kid could have his OWN SAILBOAT! He is a typical "step" child and looks at me as a person for his mom, but not for him. Which is OK, because at some point I can throw my arms up and say he's gone at 18, but I still am trying to bridge that gap so he sees me as relevant to him.

However, it is painfully obvious that this just isn't a good deal. If it was just some woodwork, plumbing, and some outboard engine work, well that's one thing, but it certainly sounds like it is much more than that.

And there's that Sword of Damocles that may rear its head in as-yet unidentified hull damage and/or delamination. No thanks...

If another "freebie" surfaces somewhere close, I may bite, but who knows.

- Jerry

 

[Randy Rutledge]

Buy a functional project boat

Find a project boat for a reasonable price that is sailable and work on it and sail it. You might be surprised at the change being on a sail boat can make. If you have a lake that is open enough that you can night sail on you can relax enjoy nature and the therapeutic benefits could be great.

Get a boat that is usable and enjoy it with the kid.

 

[Steve Swann]

Go for Quality

I am now refitting a 3rd boat. I think I am qualified to weigh in on this one, guys....

Recently, I picked up a hurricane damaged Nor'Sea 27 for a project boat. Yesterday was spent in the bottom of the bilge underneath where I had removed the pitted and holed fuel tank scraping out diesel and saltwater soaked foam. The stench almost gagged me. If I climb down into a dirty disgusting bilge, it is going to be because the boat is worth it! If I have a motor rebuilt, it is going to be a diesel. If I rebuild and repair the sails, they are going to go to a good boat. If I sew up a replacement bimini, it is going to be for a boat that I am going to spend a lot of time on. In short, I want my time expended on fixer-uppers to be more than offset by time on the water enjoying the completed project. Will you do this on a Bayliner?

In terms of your time, it doesn't really take any more effort to fix up a poorly made boat than a high quality one. In fact, some of the foundational items will give you a better starting point than a cheap boat that was cobbled together in the first place. Start with a project that will have real value when you're done. True, your decision-making will be a bit different because you will tend to fix a quality boat "right the first time" much more so than a cheaply built boat. You'll probably spend more money, but you'll get more in return. You'll use it more, too.

Also, good old boats tend to have supportive User and Owners Associations who are willing to help you through your restoration. The tips and advice you get from these sites has immeasurable value. Do you think your free Bayliner has this?

And finally, my advice is to work on a boat that EXCITES you and MOTIVATES you to stay with it until it is finished and on the water.

Steve Swann
E25 "Seahorse" (my lake sailer)
NS 27 "Hobo" (the project)
NS 27 "No News" (the trial horse)