Newbie looking at E32-3 cutter rig

[Bepi]

"Though in the back of my mind, I do wonder if getting a boat at this stage is a bit premature." Having only sailed an eight foot Sabot before I purchased Roxanne, it took me 10 days of practice and research, including the admirable "Admiral" William's video "Moving up to a larger boat" for me to feel comfortable to solo sail to Catalina. When sailing, I say out loud as though talking to a crew, "Prepare to come about!" and, "Helm alee!". I think Christian should sell t shirts with his picture (wearing a sweat band) that say "What's your plan?", which is also a phrase of his that I ask myself frequently, to my great benefit. All of this is a long way of saying, if you like the boat, buy her, and sail her!

 

[Filkee]

The 1985 32-3 that I bought started at an asking price of close to $30k. I think I wound up paying around $12,500. Crazed hatches, delaminated cabin sole, water damage to the interior wood, blisters, exhaust riser disintegrating, old radio and lousy speakers, hot water is brown and smells. All stuff that can be fixed and opportunities to negotiate on the price. I was moving up from a Coronado 15 (which I still have). I had no clue what I was getting into. A friend with a moisture meter checked the decks and declared good bones. I’ve learned so much from my own mistakes and the mistakes of others here. The punch list never ends but neither does the joy. And don’t forget that an iPad can do lots of tricks that fancy instruments can do. But now I have to check my alternator to see if it’s wrong. If it’s not one thing…But I’m a fresh water boat so do check the rigging.

Oh, and I can confirm that a 32-3 really does sail like a dinghy so it should be an easy adjustment.

 

[peaman]

I was moving up from a Coronado 15 (which I still have).

C15 was my first boat, back in 1983 (hull #2814?). It had almost as many lines as my E32-3. You did good with your end price for your boat. I paid the asking $29,900 for my E32, but it had a 1 year-old Universal M25XPB, and was in generally good shape. Except for the hot water heater, with it's awful smells, which was replaced 2 weeks ago. Keep learning.

 

[Filkee]

C15 was my first boat, back in 1983 (hull #2814?). It had almost as many lines as my E32-3. You did good with your end price for your boat. I paid the asking $29,900 for my E32, but it had a 1 year-old Universal M25XPB, and was in generally good shape. Except for the hot water heater, with it's awful smells, which was replaced 2 weeks ago. Keep learning.

1987, you’re a youngster. Reminds me of a Winona Ryder line from Heathers but I couldn’t possibly repeat it. Mine had been wrapped in plastic for five years and there were many colors of flora growing inside and out.

 

[nquigley]

No running back stays, just an hydraulic back stay.

Just FWI - there are angled slots near my upper spreaders intended for running backs. Since I have installed an inner forestay (my project report was cited above), I made a pair of dyneema runners (attachable to those slots with appropriate T-termini), adjusted and tensioned with a purchase system, that terminate at an extra pair of cars positioned near the end of the toe rail track. But, I haven't yet had a chance to use them in anger ... just set them up at the dock to mak sure they will work and can be quickly detensioned/retensioned during a tack.

 

[nquigley]

I think that the boat in that listing is at a great price for all the extras it has (I really like the dodger!). As others have said, the generally old (original?) instruments/electronics will need upgrading, but you can do that easily. I suspect it'll be sold quickly for very close to, or at, asking price (assuming a survey doesn't find any dealbreakers). Good Luck

 

[Second Wind]

I noticed this E32-3 for sale at the local marina. https://www.yachtworld.com/yacht/1986-ericson-32--3-cutter-9024354/
It's listed as a cutter, but I thought E32-3s are sloops.

I made an appointment to take a look at the boat this weekend. Is there anything in particular I should lookout for on a cutter rigged E32-3? I a newbie, I'll mostly do a cursory look to see how well the previous owner took care of the boat before deciding on a hiring a surveyor to further investigate the boat.

I am very new, having just completed Small Boat Sailing on Capri 16 at City of Ventura's Leo Robbin Community Sailing Center, their prerequisite course for ASA101. Though the city has been slow in responding to inquiries on ASA 101 class schedule. I thought of just getting a Catalina 30 since they're so ubiquitous, but Christian Williams's sailing videos introduced me to Ericson, and this this website/community made me a believer Though in the back of my mind, I do wonder if getting a boat at this stage is a bit premature.

I do want to cross oceans, but realistically I know for at least the next year or two or more I'll mostly be coastal sailing, while prepping and getting to know the boat. Once I can make to Hawaii and back, then perhaps it's time for a bigger boat.

I have an Ericson 25, 1973, that has the cutter option. I’ve been told it’s the only one in existence. I’ve sent pictures of it to countless non-believers and they’re pretty much stumped. It came with all the fittings factory installed as well as a smaller second job sail. I’ve used it once and seemed to gain one knot. And it worked pretty well in calmer winds. Great that it’s unique, but I sail without the vast majority of the time. I’m sure it was an option, probably like yours.

 

[Christian Williams]

In the days of hanked-on sails, it was useful to be able to just drop a genoa and hoist a staysail. You could cram the sails into bags and just leave them there on deck, and the sheets remained rigged..

Changing a single headsail as the wind increased or decreased was work, as you had to lower and bag it on the pitching bow, drag the bag below, then drag a smaller headsail back to the bow, hank it on, reattach the sheets, and hoist it. . It was taken for granted as just part of the fun. Crews sometimes did it several times per watch, and always came back wet. The cabin was always wet from the wet sailbags.

Roller furling changed that, along with the need for experienced crews. I suspect your staysail was before furlers.

 

[bigd14]

Though in the back of my mind, I do wonder if getting a boat at this stage is a bit premature.

No. Do it. Walter Schultz’s advice scattered throughout this video is priceless. I’ll never look at a tape measure the same way again.

 

[Christian Williams]

Walter is from the old neighborhood and an acquired taste, but his ideas are provocative and useful. He hates keel bolts (Ericson didn't) and he uses closed-cell foam instead of balsa, which owners with soggy decks can ponder. He finds Shannon boats the evidence of his own brilliance, at which you gotta smile. Here's an old video of his I liked. There are many others:

 

[JohnW]

An update. The survey/sea trial was completed last week. Again, through Christian's videos and searching the forum, I was able to rely on Jim Wallace to do the survey. The E32-3 was hulled out at Eddie's Marine Service. Looking back, because there was so much information to absorb, the whole process seemed really quick. If I had to do it all over again, I would stayed close to Jim and asked more questions, perhaps more off the record questions outside the earshot of the broker. There's always that balance between not wanting to get in people's way and satisfying one's curiosity.

The general condition was found to be above average for its age, no structural issues. A few small blisters on the bottom. The engine ran fine from a cold start. The alternator belt was quite loose, maybe to compensate for the potential alternator bracket failure? Typical of older boats, quite a few issues were found that need to be addressed. I think the boat has been just sitting at the slip since the end of 2021.

1. Rusty hose clamp at the stuffing box. The clamps looks pretty corroded. Is this just a case of replacing the hose clamps, or will it involve something more significant, ie replacing the rubber hose(requiring a haul out?). On a side note, when ordering some garden variety hose clamps a couple month ago I marvelled at the sheet number of clamp and screw material combinations offered by McMaster. Now I know why.




2. Auxiliary battery bank underneath the port dinette. Switch and bus bar need to be mounted, no clamp on connector, the lone lead acid battery needs to be in a acid proof container, all batteries need to be tied down. Are these battery the reason why the boat lists slight to port? I don't know the condition of these batteries but think I should be able sort and fix the battery cables. Though, should I be concern with the port list?





3. Galvanic corrosion at the gooseneck bracket. Is this something that is DIY-able following this remedy, https://ericsonyachts.org/ie/threads/mast-and-boom-corrosion-how-late-is-too-late.14453/ or is it something more serious ? I have very basic tig welding skill and a Miller Diversion Tig Welder.



4. Beside the small blisters, this E32-3 also has a small catalina smile. Jim recommends that the crack be v-grooved and use a paintable flexible compound to fix the smile instead of fiberglass because fiberglass will just crack again. There's evidence of prior repair with fiberglass.


I think it was mentioned that the boat will need new bottom paint. Eddie's Marine service will credit the survey haul out fee within 30 days if another haul out is needed to fix any issues from the survey. Should I do the bottom paint and repair the keel smile now, or should I sail for 6 month (in the LA area) to see what other issues may arise, ie maybe the speed peddle wheel need replacing or maybe switch to a dripless shalft seal (do I need a new prestine propeller shaft for dripless?) and delay the bottom paint and keel smile fix till then?

There are other issues such as replacing the lifeline, adding a flame detector shield to the fuel filter, adding GFI outlet, bubble in monitoring compass, CO detectors, new fire extinguishers/flares, no hot water at galley, patch the small tear on the main sail, and replacing some of the running rigging, instrumentation not showing boat speed, non-functioning mast light, alternator bracket and etc. All seem DIY-able, just requiring more time and money. I am surprised the alternator bracket retrofit kit cost $600. The Suncor stainless lifeline parts total to around one BOAT currency unit.

Going in, I know that DIY and going down interdisciplinary rabbit holes are part of owning an old sailboat. However, as the mental to do list gets longer and longer, at times I have to rethink the required time and financial commitment as mentioned by Christian, and re-read the "Buyer's Panic - E32" thread to calm myself . .. and I haven't even bought the boat yet.

Regarding why is there two TVs on the boat? I don't know. There is a spot light and a camera mounted to the bow. Though at this point when compared to other issues, I don't even care if they work or not.

I don't know if I'll end up with the boat or not. People ask me if I am happy about getting the boat, my answer is ask me in a year. That's when I'll know.

A few more images. I do like to have a dry bildge whenever possible.

 

[Christian Williams]

For a boat with a reduced price, the issues list seems minor. I don't think the gooseneck corrosion matters, the hull paint looks OK for the moment, the smile just needs "putty", the electrics mess is typical, and the list (the heel in the slip) is just loading (water tank fill status, too much gear on one side and so on).

Do you know what that liquid in the bilge is?

Lots of boats for sale, I took my time and was glad I did. But Ericsons, if you want one, can be scarce.

 

[Dave G.]

Doesn't seem to be a bad deal at all. You might want to replace or have a good look at that fuel pump. It has a lot of visible corrosion in the pic. It's a nice looking boat and that "smile" looks very minor. I repaired my keel joint with West G-Flex Epoxy a few seasons ago and still looks great. Can't really tell the condition of the stuffing box from the pic but if the hose needs replacing too you'll need to pull the boat. I'm biased but if it's in poor condition I would replace with a dripless seal.

 

[Dave G.]

There is a spot light and a camera mounted to the bow

Maybe it was used as a docking aid ?

 

[Loren Beach]

Going in, I know that DIY and going down interdisciplinary rabbit holes are part of owning an old sailboat. However, as the mental to do list gets longer and longer, at times I have to rethink the required time and financial commitment as mentioned by Christian, and re-read the "Buyer's Panic - E32" thread to calm myself . .. and I haven't even bought the boat yet.

You might enjoy this link to a well-regarded surveyor's site. http://www.alisonmazon.com/faults-7/common_faluts.html
A lot of solid info (that reinforces the value of a survey) and a bit of wry humor as well.

A note about the port list. Many boats, when not loaded very much will have some list one side or the other, due to tankage or furniture placement. Our '88 hull lists some to port until I fill up the starboard side water tank and then it levels out.
Further, I also moved up the OEM water line paint about 2 inches, which is a time honored solution to this problem.

Take note of heavy bits installed by prior owners that may cause/contribute to this list. Heavy parts like ancient ferroresonant chargers, extra batteries, added tankage, and other anchors or chain stored with no regard for balancing the boat. Back when our boat was built in '88, they installed a brute of a charger on the port side which just made things worse. I replaced it right away with a new-technology solid state unit -and- moved it to the starboard side. And, so on, and so on....

 

[Pete the Cat]

You have to replace the stuffing box for this boat to be safe and that means removing the shaft. That means you can inspect the shaft and cutless bearing at the same time but this can a bear to do and will require some boatyard talent and judgement. If the salt water leak spray on the coupling (very common) you might have a significant cost getting the shaft out. You may find you need a new shaft, coupling, and stuffing box. It looks like someone bonded the stuffing box which seems like a weird thing to do. Did you pick the surveyor, or did the selling broker?

 

[Bolo]

Maybe it was used as a docking aid ?

Yes, that caught me eye too. Is it a IR camera for seeing in the dark?

 

[Alan Gomes]

You have to replace the stuffing box for this boat to be safe and that means removing the shaft. That means you can inspect the shaft and cutless bearing at the same time but this can a bear to do and will require some boatyard talent and judgement. If the salt water leak spray on the coupling (very common) you might have a significant cost getting the shaft out. You may find you need a new shaft, coupling, and stuffing box. It looks like someone bonded the stuffing box which seems like a weird thing to do. Did you pick the surveyor, or did the selling broker?

And when the stuffing box hose is replaced he should use actual stuffing box hose for this. It is much thicker and made for this purpose.

 

[JohnW]

The liquid in the bilge is clear. The color is a reflection of the bottom of the bilge.. I am guessing sea or rain water? maybe from the stuffing box? or rain water from the mast?

The camera looks like regular cctv camera with IR leds. I don't know how well it still works based on the exterior condition. I don't think the camera or the wiring was built for marine environment.

Yes, the stuffing box is worrisome. For a newbie there's always too many things to worry about. However I don't worry about the surveyor. I picked the surveyor based on searching this and other forums. He seems well regarded by knowledgeable and logical people. That's good enough for me.

On a side, I went sailing with the Buccaneer Yacht Club a few times and I think I found my physical sailing community. Even though they are more race oriented, I did meet a few members doing DIY repair/upgrades. One them just returned from a weekend Catalina trip and regaled us with tale of a leaking holding tank made worst by heeling, and black water cleanup. I don't think any of the members has an Ericson, though next to one of the member's wooden boat, there is a nicely maintained dark blue Ericson 32-3 that still has its original owners.

 

[windblown]

About the added inner stay - I am certainly no expert but have visited aboard a number of boats with an inner stay and all tied the lower tang to an internal bulkhead or to an inner wire or rod stay that went down to a strong point under the forepeak. Some, that did not regularly use that sail, did have the inner "bracing stay" attached by a snap shackle so that the forepeak was open for comfortable sleeping at anchor or at the dock. The upper attachment will need runners, also, to keep the mast in column.
I just do not think that an actual NA designed that stay conversion on that boat. While an Ericson is stronger than the average boat, that is a force the rig was not designed for by Mr King.

This opinion valued at 2 cents, altho discounts are regularly offered.....

I’ve given a lot of thought to the recent comments here about the 32-3 cutter rig. The inner forestay on our boat was part of the original commissioning (per the invoice that we have), though apparently it was a local boat dealer add-on, not an Ericson option, as I had previously thought. It is secured to the foredeck, where it has been for the last 39 years, but it has never been reinforced with a bulkhead or hardware “bracing stay” in the v-berth below. We also do not have running back stays. Though we have a hank-on staysail in very good condition, we’ll be decommissioning the inner forestay this season.
I owe you at least 2 cents, Loren.