Factory Deck Hardware Installation

[Rob]

Can anyone tell me whether Ericson reamed out deck core and filled the gaps with epoxy (or employed some similar technique) before mounting deck hardware? Alternatively did Ericson simply drill into the deck and count on the sealant to protect the core? How did Ericson's method compare with other manufacturers' methods (both then and now)?

My boat is an '85 E26. I'm just wondering whether I should pro-actively re-bed everything "Don-Casey-style".

 

[rwthomas1]

FWIW, my E38 didn't have any filled areas where deck hardware bolts pass through. Just exposed wood core.... I would rebed as needed Don Casey style. Pick away at it. Doing it all in one shot would likely be a pretty large project. RT

 

[Frank Langer]

I have read that the areas on the deck where fittings are intended are reinforced with plywood rather than the balsa core--stanchions, winches, etc. This would likely not apply to any area where a previous owner installed cleats or other fittings after the boat left the factory.
Frank.

 

[WhiteNoise]

Here and there on my 30+

I know that some were because I just completely recored my starboard deck from the shrouds back to the winches. I have been meaning to take pictures to show you guys but kept forgetting my camera. :loser: I have it now and will take some pics while it is still all open.

As to answer the question, on my 1984 30+ all the lifeline stantion bases were extremely (overly) reinforced. Under each base the core is plywood and it is drilled out and filled with pure resin where the bolts go through and there is a fiberglass backing plate under all of this.

Very solid ... as long as the genoa track (at the high point of the deck) doesn't leak like crazy ,which has none of the aforementioned improvements except for the plywood core. Hence the replaced (completely shot) deck. I don't know why they didn't do all of the through bolted hardware, or at least the hardware that every model had. I could understand blocks, organizers, etc.

BTW, I mentioned ply core under these components. The rest of the core is balsa.

I have now drilled out and filled all the areas where bolts pass through under both tracks. The winches, shroud bases, deck organizers, etc. were like the genoa tracks. All are being drilled, filled, and rebedded as I go.

I will send some pics of the project. It's been hell but the outcome is great.

-Chris

 

[Frank Langer]

Thanks, Chris. I would be very interested in seeing your pictures.
Frank
1984 E30+

 

[Rob]

Thanks for the replies.

Chris - I'm actually surprised that some holes (like those for the stantions) had been filled with resin. I've been operating under the assumption that the factory just drilled through the core and relied on the sealant.

Sure, labour costs are an issue for manufacturers. But I really have to wonder why a manufacturer wouldn't use FRP core (under deck fixtures) or otherwise ream 'n resin those deck holes. Seems to me that doing so would practically eliminate any chance of deck delamination. Probably a good marketing angle too. I'd be interested to know if there's a manufacturer out there that actually does so.

 

[WhiteNoise]

some do I think

I think Island Packet, Tartan, and some of the "high end" production boat builders do as of late. If I remember correctly I overheard an Island Packet rep say that through bolt installations were through solid material, epoxy based I believe. Don't quote me on that, it was at the Norwalk Boat show about 2 years ago.

As far as the core under the stantion bases, I can attest to that. Griding out the resin plugs and resin saturated ply during the de-coring process was too much fun for words. (Extreme sarcasm intended , haha) I agree, I am surprised they did not market it. Not that my boat is of early fiberglass boat vintage but early on, as we all know, boat builders were still not sure how exactly think the glass layup needed to be. Taking into account the TAFG system on my boat and similiar models, maybe they intended to somewhat overbuild her. She was marketed as an "ocean capable coastal cruiser" I believe.

Sorry I have not been able to take pictures yet. Went back down to the boat yesterday evening but the weather was horrible and the light in the cabin was too poor to take any decent pics. I will do so tonight hopefully.

 

[Seth]

Deck coring

IIRC, the standard method was that in areas originally designed for deck hardware mounting the core was removed and plywood placed in those areas as protection against deck compression from through bolts. These areas include all of the places where there is no non-skid (under the genoa tracks, where halyard stoppers go, winch pads, etc.

If you add hardware in other areas of the deck which are under significant load, you may want to use resin or actually cut the foam out and use plywood.

S

 

[valentor]

Seth;

What if the core is balsa where you are adding the new hardware? Is it sufficient to use resin and a large backing plate? Or would you recommend removing the balsa and replacing it with plywood?

-Steve

 

[Loren Beach]

"Core Values"

Until Seth checks back...
I can say with some certainty, after a lot of time working under our side decks last season on the stanchion project, that in '88 they were using fender washers under the bolts for our winches and genny tracks, and that the coring I saw thru the translucent inner layer of FRP was balsa.
Note that if you refrain from point-loading the nuts under the balsa with your half inch socket breaker bar.... you are not going to crush the coring.
Ours looks dry and clean, like new, actually.

Someday, when I rebed the rest of the stuff on the side decks, I will overbore and epoxy-fill these bolt holes just to be safe. Having been leak-free up to this point, and having removed a large number of factory-bedded fittings around the entire deck perimeter I find that the builders did an excellent job of sealing parts down on our particular boat. I have to give Kudos to some long-forgotten Ericson factory workers for their efforts, regardless of occasional oddities in the way they planned some of the routing cables and hoses... in some weird places in the boat.

Speaking of plywood coring, I have found a large piece of it under the cockpit sole where the wheel pedistal is bolted down. Considering that the wheel was optional, they must have correctly forsaw that many owners would want this added.

Speaking for retrofitting some backing, why not simply add backing plates of 1/4" G10 under the winch (or whatever deck part) after you epoxy in the holes?

Regards,
Loren
1988 O-34 #8

 

[Seth]

Yup

Loren is right on all counts. And yes- they did pre-install plywood in a number of areas where there was a high percentage of owners choosing options that required bolted through parts-like the pedestal, and I believe the areas where the halyard stoppers go (on either side of the main hatch).
Cheers