Epoxy Calamity

[Bolo]

About a month ago, when it was still a bit cold in Maryland (not like today when it was almost ninety degrees) I was filling some holes in the cabin top that was were two winches were bolted through. So I used decided to use the “fast” hardener sold by West System. I normally use the “slow” hardener. I probably mixed a bit too much in the plastic mixing pot which I had sitting on a cutting board. After using the hypo to fill the holes I noticed steam or maybe smoke coming out of the plastic mixing pot. Realizing the epoxy was over heating by way of the curing process I panicked and picked up the pot instead of picking up the cutting board and the pot. Did I mention that I was doing this in the galley? As I quickly made my way into the cockpit the bottom of the pot started to give way splashing curing epoxy as I made my way to the dock. But then the bottom was really giving out so I pitched the whole thing into the water. Rushing back to find my plastic scraper I tried to remove as much curing epoxy from the cockpit wall and non-skid. Still much remained and I stopped because I was just spreading it out more.

So now that it’s cured and looking liked dried snot in the cockpit (sorry for the analogy but it’s really the best descriptio) how to get it off the gel coat and non-skid without damaging them in the process if that’s even possible? I did some reading and one site suggested careful use of a heat gun and plastics scraper. Another suggested using something cold, like refrigerant gas, to make the epoxy brittle that will allow it to be chipped off easier. As of right now I’m not sure what to try so I’m asking here. Ever had this issue? If so did you successfully get it off and how? Or if you never had this problem but know an answer or suggestion then please share and thanks.

 

[Frank Langer]

About a month ago, when it was still a bit cold in Maryland (not like today when it was almost ninety degrees) I was filling some holes in the cabin top that was were two winches were bolted through. So I used decided to use the “fast” hardener sold by West System. I normally use the “slow” hardener. I probably mixed a bit too much in the plastic mixing pot which I had sitting on a cutting board. After using the hypo to fill the holes I noticed steam or maybe smoke coming out of the plastic mixing pot. Realizing the epoxy was over heating by way of the curing process I panicked and picked up the pot instead of picking up the cutting board and the pot. Did I mention that I was doing this in the galley? As I quickly made my way into the cockpit the bottom of the pot started to give way splashing curing epoxy as I made my way to the dock. But then the bottom was really giving out so I pitched the whole thing into the water. Rushing back to find my plastic scraper I tried to remove as much curing epoxy from the cockpit wall and non-skid. Still much remained and I stopped because I was just spreading it out more.

So now that it’s cured and looking liked dried snot in the cockpit (sorry for the analogy but it’s really the best descriptio) how to get it off the gel coat and non-skid without damaging them in the process if that’s even possible? I did some reading and one site suggested careful use of a heat gun and plastics scraper. Another suggested using something cold, like refrigerant gas, to make the epoxy brittle that will allow it to be chipped off easier. As of right now I’m not sure what to try so I’m asking here. Ever had this issue? If so did you successfully get it off and how? Or if you never had this problem but know an answer or suggestion then please share and thanks.

Have you considered phoning epoxy experts, like West Systems, who know their product and what might work best. I would get lots of opinions, and proceed carefully to avoid making it worse.
Frank

 

[David Vaughn]

TotalBoat suggests this. Doesn't sound overly optimistic, but it's worth a try. Good luck.

I had a somewhat similar problem epoxying a custom battery box for a previous boat.
Working under the carport, had just finished the last coat of glass, had a bit of epoxy left on the brush, when a wasp decided to play chicken with my face.
Guess who flinched first. Then guess where that bit of epoxy from the brush ended up. Nope, landed on the left rear quarter panel of my 1990 Mariner Blue Miata. Didn't find it for several days. It's not very big, so I left it. Decided not to mess with the original paint.

Sigh. Boat projects.

 

[Loren Beach]

If it were me, and it's not, I would try to scrape it carefully with a sharp edge plastic scrapper. A razor blade would be tempting but might put nicks and gouges into the surface.

 

[Frank Langer]

If it were me, and it's not, I would try to scrape it carefully with a sharp edge plastic scrapper. A razor blade would be tempting but might put nicks and gouges into the surface.

I would guess that Loren's thought of a plastic scraper might work better if you can grind down any raised, goopy areas so that the final area you're trying to scrape/chisel away is as thin as possible, being careful to avoid damaging the underlying gel coat.
Frank

 

[Bolo]

I’m gonna document my efforts an report them here as I go along. Maybe even produce a video about it on my YouTube channel. In the meantime I sent an email to West Systems support to see what they recommend before proceeding.

 

[JPS27]

I would practice self flagellation for my misdeed in the form of getting down there and sanding it off ever so carefully no matter how much is on the cabin sole or deck. I would think that other methods would do more harm with a simple slip or misjudgment. This would take long enough to put you back in the good graces of any higher power that may exist.

 

[DLM-E30]

I have had success with the heat gun and a hardwood block or stick with sharp corners. It's a slow process, but In got the drips out of a non-skid deck. finished up with some tedious sanding with 320 wet-or-dry sandpaper. The mesh sanding disks at Home Depot also work well folded over a stick that matches the angle of the non-skid.

 

[Christian Williams]

As Bob teaches, epoxy allowed to pool deep goes off much faster--and suddenly. After mixing in a cup, pour into a shallow tray so it spreads a quarter-inch deep or so, which greatly extends the working life. I too have tossed the firecracker overboard, lesson learned.

By the way, in the early days of fiberglass repairs to wooden boats, the proper derogatory term was frozen snot.

 

[tenders]

Hot West System has a weird hospital-bandage smell, doesn’t it? It’s a smell that has no place on a boat, it can be a little dangerous, and I’ve become conditioned to curse whenever I detect it.

The next time you emerge from this kind of crisis - and we’ve all been there, don’t be embarrassed, it’s a rite of passage - keep in mind that there is a huge difference in hardness and adhesion between today’s epoxy and tomorrow’s epoxy. Get the spills up off the deck or wherever they land before the overnight cure. Vinegar is supposed to work but I always use acetone.

Similarly, if you’re sanding epoxy, especially epoxy fairing compound, sanding within 24 hours is FAR FAR easier than sanding it after a full cure.

As an amateur who tends to use epoxy outside, I learned long ago never to buy “fast” hardener. Sometimes you CAN use it, but most of the time you can’t due to factors like high outside temperature, direct sunlight, big batches, longer application time desired, etc. Not worth storing the container of fast hardener just for those rare instances where a faster cure time might be desirable. It’s rarely necessary.

 

[Bolo]

As Bob teaches, epoxy allowed to pool in a container goes off much faster--and suddenly. After mixing in a cup, pour into a shallow tray so it spreads a quarter-inch deep or so, which greatly extends the working life. I too have tossed the firecracker overboard, lesson learned.

By the way, in the early days of fiberglass repairs to wooden boats, the proper derogatory term was frozen snot.

And you know Christian, I knew that about how fast epoxy can go off in a container, yet I still failed to pour it into a tray to reduce its depth but I was in a hurry to do the job and concentrated too much on getting epoxy into the holes. The real lesson here is to take your time, be methodical, take the necessary steps especially when working with reactive chemicals on board a boat. Even us “old salts” who’ve work on our boats for many years can make mistakes. Now I’m left with having to clean up my mess rather then spend the time working on something else or more importantly, sailing.

 

[JSM]

Although this doesn't help your current situation I've found that having a bottle of white vinegar on hand when playing with epoxy to be a life saver. I usually manage to get epoxy where it doesn't belong ( including my hair ) vinegar totally destroys wet epoxy and is great for cleaning tools and hands.

 

[Christian Williams]

Yes, and my garage smells like a salad. Vinegar is so wonderfully cheap.

 

[Shankara]

I’ve had this happen with too much product in too small of a container.

I learned from a friend that these Dolma tin cans are the perfect size container. Wide and shallow so it won’t get crazy. Easy to clean and reuse.

These also work good for when it’s real cold to keep the epoxy thin. Warm water in a pan on a hot plate and float the can with mix in the water.

 

[u079721]

As most folks know you can not dissolve cured epoxy. But certain solvents such as acetone can swell the material and make it much easier to scrap away. I haven't checked lately but there have been solvents sold just for this purpose.

 

[Nick J]

Xylene works well with uncured epoxy. I keep some around and try to have it on hand while I'm working with epoxy, but it is nasty stuff. If vinegar works just as well and I can stop using xylene, it sounds like a win.

We had a small fire in the composite lab when I was in school. Some students left a large container of mixed epoxy unattended and it went off. Ironically, the professor had been a volunteer firefighter for a long time but had never actually been involved in a fire. When the fire happened, he was out of town catching up on his fire training. Since that incident, I have been very careful about leaving epoxy unattended without spreading it out, but I still had my own first-hand experience a few years ago.

After completing the port side cabin top re-coring by breaking up the glass work into small 18" x 18" sections, I thought I could do the starboard side in a larger section. I wetted out apx. 18" x 3' of 2 layers of 1708 on a table, rolled it up on to a 4" piece of PVC and attempted to unroll it upside down onto the bottom of the cabin top. After 15 minutes of struggling I scrapped the attempt. I was covered in epoxy, the plastic that converted the salon of my 25+ into something that resembled a room fit for Dexter was covered, and I had a large curing sheet of fiberglass to deal with. I was paranoid of epoxy getting behind the plastic and creating a mess in the boat, so I threw the glass in a garbage bag and placed it on the dock. In the 20 minutes I had spend cleaning the boat, the sheet had started to kick in the plastic bag. It was smoking and the bag was starting to melt. I laid some more garbage bags on the dock, cut the bag open, and carefully spread the sheet on the dock then dumped some water on it. Thankfully I caught it in time and I avoided flames. The day was a complete failure, but I reinforced my healthy appreciation for epoxy's ability to start fires and the value of a Tyvek suit.

 

[bigd14]

Dolma tin cans

And they don't melt or catch fire when you mess it up!

Blowing up the epoxy pot is a rite of passage. I have had to earn my epoxy stripes several times over by now.

 

[mjsouleman]

Been there, Done that, Don't want to do it again.

 

[Prairie Schooner]

Hi Bob,
In doing research for something else I came across this stuff:

https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/p/d/b40070703/

"Product removes reactive adhesives from a variety of substrates
Reactive adhesives include adhesives that require a hardener or catalyst in order for the bond to occur
Examples of reactive adhesives include, but are not limited to, epoxies, urethanes and silicones"

But, gelcoat is probably also considered a reactive adhesive.

I don't think it's what I'm looking for, but, FWIW.
Jeff

 

[Bolo]

I’ve had this happen with too much product in too small of a container.

I learned from a friend that these Dolma tin cans are the perfect size container. Wide and shallow so it won’t get crazy. Easy to clean and reuse.

These also work good for when it’s real cold to keep the epoxy thin. Warm water in a pan on a hot plate and float the can with mix in the water.

View attachment 46711

Purrrrfect! And I have a cat too! Great idea.