Correct way to tie sheets to Genoa?

[rwthomas1]

Hello all,
I have fairly large sheets, 1" on my 125% genoa on my E38. I have attached them with a bowline knot for each. Is there a less messy knot to attach two large sheets like this? I have looked in my knot book but can't seem to find an alternative. I am thinking that splicing an eye in each and then using a large shackle may work better? Thanks, RT

 

[NateHanson]

Wow, 1"? Is that because you find it easier to handle? I suspect that line size is overkill by about two-fold. I believe we used 1/2" or 9/16" sheets on our Hinckley38.

At any rate, I wouldn't use a shackle because that'll be a very damaging thing to have flogging around on deck. It could remove a chunk of the mast, damage the rigging, and certainly remodel your head.

I've seen some boats simply use a single long sheet, and slip a bight of line through the clew, then pass both ends of the line through the eye, and return to each side. It seemed to me that this could slip, but it seems to work. Another disadvantage is if you change headsails, this is a cumbersome sheet to remove.

A stunsail tack bend would make a more compact knot than a bowline, but they can be hard to remove after being stressed, so again it might not work well with frequent sail changes.

Another idea for using the bight of the line would be a butterfly knot. It's a fairly compact knot for creating an eye in the bight that will take loads from the two ends without deforming.

I think you'd improve light-wind sailing a lot if you reduced the diameter of your sheets though. Does 1" sound oversized to anyone else?

 

[u079721]

1" is HUGE

1" is HUGE for the sheets on your 38. Mine came with 1/2" sheets, which were easy to hand, and well up to the load. But they were actually too small for the non-adjustable self tailing groove on the Lewmar 52s. So when I needed to replace them I went with 5/8" regatta braid, which fit the self tailing groove just perfectly, but were awfully heavy in light air. I suspect the PO on your boat may have also wanted something that fit the Lewmar 52s well, but 1" is way too much. I can well imagine that two bowlines with that big a line would be quite a bit at the clew of your genny.

But with our 5/8" line the two bowlines worked just fine. The only other knot I would suggest is a buntline hitch, which is quite compact and secure, though it does tend to jam. But what I would really suggest is new sheets. Find the smallest line that fits your winches and go with it, all the way down to 1/2" if possible. Do not use a shackle!

 

[Seth]

1" is too big

You are pretty stuck if you stay with the 1" stuff-none of those other solutions will work with such big line and a normal clew ring. The whole problem is the line size-we use 1" on 80 footers-not 38 footers. Get a reasonable size line and your options go up and problems go away!

Good luck,

S

 

[rwthomas1]

Well, judging by the responses my boat is WAY overkill in the line department! It came setup that way, not my choice! I will be looking into going smaller on everything. Thanks, RT

 

[Bob in Va]

If you do use a bowline...

A finished bowline has a "smooth" side and a "rough" side, so you can tie the sheets to the clew in such a way that the rough sides face each other and the smooth sides are "out". Believe it or not, this makes a difference in the probability of a hang-up when the sail comes across. It also helps a little to tie the loop large enough so that the tail stays inside it rather than being forced out at an angle.

 

[jkenan]

Buy a single length of rope that is twice the length of one sheet. Then find the mid-point of that rope, and push it thru the clew, forming an eye on the other side of the clew. Pull the eye out enough and form a bowline around the two lines on the other side of the clew, and as you finish the bowline, pass the ends of the two lines thru the eye (you will have to pull the full length of each rope thru the eye to tighten).

You now have one non-slip modified bowline (probably another name for the knot, but I don't know) serving both port and starboard sheets. Great for roller furling, not great if you expect to change sails frequently.

Don't use a shackle, It'll kill you or someone else.

 

[Seth]

He is right about the shackle

Yup...stay away from the shackle. The single sheet idea is not appropriate for bigger boats-the 29 is about as big a boat as I would go with that idea (and I would not do it on anything except a dinghy)-there are many reasons why it may be necessary to remove or re-lead a genoa sheet, so the ability to untie one of them from the clew is important-from a seamanship and sail trim point of view-An example is on a long beam-broad reach. Take the windward sheet around to the lee side and run it through a forward block on the rail, then to the cockpit-so you now have 2 active sheets on the sail, and you can now get get the lead to the proper forward and out board position. In these conditions, to get optimal trim, it is often necessary to use both sheets together to put the clew in the ideal spot. Of course, some folks would leave the regular jib sheets alone and run a a 3rd "short sheet" for this, but the clew starts to get a bit crowded....get 2 sheets of the right diameter (this will depend on what line quality/material you select) and do it right-you'll be glad you did!

Sail safe,
S

 

[Mike Thomas]

I don’t know if there is a “correct” way but.....
I tie a loop in the end of each sheet and do kind of what John described. I thread the loop through the clew and pass the line through the loop. Then do the same form the other side with the other sheet. If you lay one loop through the other where it passes through the clew (did that make sense?) you end up with a really smooth set up.

On a smaller boats 24ft I have used the method that John described. It easy, works well and it's nice to have another really long line on the boat for emergencies.

Ping me back if what I wrote doesn’t make sense. It sounded rite in my head

 

[Tazman]

Jib sheets on '85 32'

We just replaced the Jib sheets for our Genoa. We went with a 9/16 or 1/2" line (PO had used 5/8". Instead of using a tying two jib sheets to the clew (as the PO had done,) we kept the sheet in one piece and looped it through the clew as described above. We test sailed it yesterday in 5-15 kt wind and found that tacking was much easier and the lighter line allowed the jib to sail better (may have been my emagination.) Also, when time comes to replace it, I would prefer to have a long old line instead of two short lines.