Boom Brake for Intentional Gybe

gadangit

Member III
We've been doublehanding our boat in the spinnaker category all summer and I'm looking for a way to handle the main during a gybe. I've searched through the archives and read all the gybing and boom brake threads I can find, but I didn't get a feel for a consensus on using a boom brake for an intentional gybe under normal racing conditions (moderate wind and sea state.)

I found the Wichard Gyb'Easy Boom Brake, which appears to be something that might allow the boom to go quickly, but with control to the other side. Has anyone used one of these for this purpose before?

We had the kite up last night in about 15+kts of breeze and my plan was to pick the longest leg to run under spinnaker, douse and make the mark with the genoa. We carried the mark, so not needed this time. I'll change my strategy when they start offering some cash prizes!

I have a standing rule that I don't buy anything for the boat just racing, so if anyone thinks this works, can you please help me justify for cruising as well?

Chris
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
I think the danger is the boom rising up and hitting the backstay. But it seems to me that would take other factors too, like falling off a wave or a wild broach. And for cruising boats like ours, the vang can stay on.

In hairy racing conditions with too much sail up and a chute, the crew anticipated the violence of the boom jibe by hauling in and then quickly parsing out the sheet.

I guess they were the boom brake. Never used the other kind myself.

Added: When pushing limits downwind it's important to make sure the traveler car is set--which is often the last thing on anybody's mind. A loose car, even in a controlled jibe, can hurt people or itself. And if it comes off the track, well....
 
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gadangit

Member III
With crew we always have someone on the mainsheet hauling away and then quickly easing as the main comes across.

And because we are doublehanding on local bay races, we take a conservative approach to what sails go up. The chances of us being in conditions where the boom might rise up to hit the backstay (can it reach that high??) is probably nil. Lisa wouldn't allow it.
That dang traveller line cleated is the easiest thing to miss. I am usually driving, so it is my responsibility. I'm constantly looking around for someone to blame, but to no avail. Lisa gives me the look and shakes her head. Shame. Shame.

Anybody with boom brake experience on intentional gybes?
 

bgary

Advanced Beginner
Blogs Author
Most of the boom brakes I've seen (including the Wichard) involve another line. Generally dead-ended to the rail somewhere near the chainplates, routed through the brake device, then to a block on the opposite rail and aft to where you can reach it. The idea is that when the line is loose, there's almost no resistance at the brake, but if you tighten the line, the friction increases and the boom brake is more effective at controlling the movement of the boom.

The problem (IMHO) is that it is another line to get in the way of all sorts of other things. And it will be in the way all the time, not just when gibing.

My thought is that in under 20 knots (*) of breeze, it's an option to steer DDW, center the main (sheet and traveler), gibe the front half of the boat, then let the main out on the new gibe as you come up to course. Might be a bit slower, but you're in control of the main the whole way.

(* don't use this approach if you are in enough breeze that a centered main could cause you to round-up mid gibe)
 

Loren Beach

O34 - Portland, OR
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Apropos of boom control, I once did a bit of crewing on a (winning!) C&C 30 that used port and starboard preventers rather than a vang. When a jibe was called for the ends of those lines on either side of the cockpit combing were controlled and fed out and taken in as needed. Worked pretty well as far as I could tell.

I do not have racing experience (and the requisite mark-rounding in heavy traffic...) on big boats so have no experience with tackle loaded up like the main sheet on an E-39.
:0

Loren
 
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gadangit

Member III
The problem (IMHO) is that it is another line to get in the way of all sorts of other things. And it will be in the way all the time, not just when gibing.

My thought is that in under 20 knots (*) of breeze, it's an option to steer DDW, center the main (sheet and traveler), gibe the front half of the boat, then let the main out on the new gibe as you come up to course. Might be a bit slower, but you're in control of the main the whole way.

(* don't use this approach if you are in enough breeze that a centered main could cause you to round-up mid gibe)

^This is pretty much what we do when cruising along, but we are pretty well loaded up when racing.

We are doublehanding while racing to improve our boat handling and working together under stressed conditions. So we have to do a little dance with the spinnaker work to maximize our respective strengths and to improve skills. We are very conservative on mark roundings and will actually delay hoisting our spinnaker to let the other boats clear out. I'm fine with close quarter work in a crowd rounding the mark, our boat handles like a big dinghy. But I try to let the serious guys do their thing.

We switched roles recently to let Lisa get some foredeck work. The spinnaker up and down was always a mystery to her, so she wanted to get some time up there. This is my preferred method as I have the ability to manage the boat, main and the spinnaker sheet all at the same time. Well, not the same exact time, but close enough. Lisa struggles with all that and having the strength to move things around when loaded. She hoists the spinnaker in the sock, waits for my okay, hoists the sock and runs back to cleat the sock line on the way to the cockpit to start trimming. Sometimes she has to roll up the genoa if I didn't get to it.

On the gybe we have another dance. I take the spin sheet, Lisa trims the mainsheet as much as she can without rounding up the boat and then takes the helm. She'll initiate the gybe and I'll pull the spinnaker through to the other side. She never had the strength to get it all the way through. Usually the spinnaker is retrimmed and we are on our new heading before the main comes across. Sometimes the main is trimmed way too tight, so we have a quick change of positions so I can manage the wheel and ease the main as quickly as possible. The boat is usually rounding up fast so the helm is hard, the mainsheet is hard and Lisa is begging me to hurry to get the traveller down because the spinnaker is now loading up. This all happens fast and it is equally fast to unload everything. That last part is what I am trying to avoid.

On the douse, I'll take the spin sheet, Lisa pulls out the headsail and goes forward to pull down the sock. Sometimes the socked spinnaker is loaded up pretty good and always outside the headsail. We swap positions again, she drives and I horse the sock around or under the headsail and get it into the hatch while she tails the halyard. Lisa is not super comfortable driving during that transition, so she prefers going forward to pull down the sock. It is a lot of load for her, but it is well within her abilities.

So, that sounds like a lot of work for two people, but that is what it takes to get a 20,000lb boat around a race course with just two people with unmatched skills. We've tried several other crew position combinations, so far this is the one that works. I've watched some videos to see the boom brake in action, I think it might work. If it does, the extra line would be worth the trouble.

As a side, this is all distance course racing, no windward leewards. We couldn't sustain that level of activity!

Chris
 

gadangit

Member III
Apropos of boom control, I once did a bit of crewing on a (winning!) C&C 30 that used port and starboard preventers rather than a vang. When a jibe was called for the ends of those lines on either side of the cockpit combing were controlled and fed out and taken in as needed. Worked pretty well as far as I could tell.

I do not have racing experience (and the requisite mark-rounding in heavy traffic...) on big boats so have no experience with tackle loaded up like the main sheet on an E-39.
:0

Loren

I can see how dual preventers would work but it seems like a broach waiting to happen without a dedicated crew to manage it. I know we'd forget or not get to it in time. Long passages seems it like a great idea.

Well, the main coming across and crashing is a bit unsettling even when you are expecting it. The traveller and all the mounting is new. But I am looking at doing some reinforcing midspan. Having the traveller across the companionway garage doesn't give me much to work with as far as something solid to attach to. I've got some ideas, but I'll probably tackle that this fall when the weather cools down.

Chris
 

supersailor

Contributing Partner
The trouble with using a boom brake on a spinnaker run is, if you broach during the gybe and the boom brake jambs, you are in deep trouble.
 
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gadangit

Member III
The trouble with using a boom brake on a spinnaker run is, if you broach during the gybe and the boom brake jambs, you are in deep trouble.

Agreed. We just don't put up the kite in those conditions where a broach is possible, especially when short handed. Even if we are racing in the spinnaker class and the conditions are uncomfortable, we just forego the spinnaker. The reality is running down the rhumbline at hull speed in big wind is faster anyway. The J-boats and others are covering a lot of ground with their gybe angles.
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Chris,

Regarding the spinnaker, I'm curious if you feel it stabilizes the boat and maybe reduces rolling dead downwind. On some boats the lift of the chute tends to keep the bow up and changes the ride for the better.

I've never set one on our hull shape.
 

gadangit

Member III
Chris,

Regarding the spinnaker, I'm curious if you feel it stabilizes the boat and maybe reduces rolling dead downwind. On some boats the lift of the chute tends to keep the bow up and changes the ride for the better.

I've never set one on our hull shape.

We have a more general purpose assym, so it takes a bit of pressure to be able to rotate it around and go that deep. We generally sail 110-140 AWA. When there is enough pressure to rotate the spinnaker and we go deeper it is definitely more stable. This actually happened the other night during an informal race. The tack line was a bit longer than normal and the sail rotated further than usual. I heard we had 17kts +/- of wind. I think the pressure staying in the sail made for a very nice deep run. We were DDW down some small waves, the boat was in complete control the whole time.

Quartering seas are a bear and the boat is a handful. That is one of the reason we got a bigger wheel, but Lisa still refuses to drive in those conditions. It is very easy to lose the kite if you aren't proactively steering before the wave gets there.

I have friends that have an E38 (later model, not sure year) and my sense is that it is a much more tender boat. We carry a 130% headsail just fine when they are sailing a 95%. The only time I crewed with them flying a spinnaker it was very light air and they were trying out their new large downwind kite. They don't fly their kite much, so I can't give you any direct feedback to the E38.

Chris
 

supersailor

Contributing Partner
The spinnaker makes the boat faster which opens the hole in the water amidships. This reduces the stability. The boat is more prone to a broach. Also, the center of effort is more foreword. The symmetrical spinnakers carry a lot more power down wind than the asymmetrical spinnakers do(which is why I love them). I have two. A 1/2oz drifter and a 1.5oz triradial. The first time I set the triradial, we were in the Trincomali channel, we were doing 2.4kns on a beam reach. We set the triradial and suddenly were doing 5.7kns. It's interesting what adding 1243sf of additional sail can do. The next question was how to get it down. That thing is big! The answer now is an ATN sleeve (old age). I can do this all myself now.

Type in spinnaker broach, San Francisco Bay for how fast broaches happen and how exciting they can be. That's my old racing ground and it can be heart pounding. The wind can be tricky. Don't expect that the wind will play by the rules and stay light. Recently, I was out on the Straights and the wind was calm. There was a dark line on the water and within 5 minutes we had two reefs in the main.
 
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Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Interesting. We are just not downwind boats. The flatter aft sections of subsequent designs changed everything.

But I beat, or close reached, for two weeks straight, and the 32-3 seemed born for it.
 

supersailor

Contributing Partner
The Ericson fleet does have some very fast downwind boats. The Olsen series is capable of double digit speeds on spinnaker runs and while surfing. Quite invigorating! I'll take my E-34 upwind, though. You can't have everything.
 

paul culver

Member III
I use a piece of climbing hardware called an "eight" at mid boom for a brake. Works great. The main reason I use it is in case the autohelm loses its mind going down wind. It occasionally happens.

Paul
E29 "Bear"
 

gadangit

Member III
I use a piece of climbing hardware called an "eight" at mid boom for a brake. Works great. The main reason I use it is in case the autohelm loses its mind going down wind. It occasionally happens.

Paul
E29 "Bear"

Funny, we talked about digging that out of Lisa's old bag of climbing gear and trying it out. Now that you bring it up, I might ask her to find it so we can see if it might be worth a try.

Thanks for chiming in Paul!
Chris
 
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