Boat anxiety

[northerner]

So, we have inspected and sea trialed, and now we will be shortly surveying, then probably finalizing within the next two weeksI alternate between happiness, and anxiety/terror. We are stepping up from a 26 foot trailerabe boat to an E 34The fears are about maintenance, knowing the boat needs some TLC, along with rebedding 3-4 windows that are leaking. That's just the tip of the iceberg for a 1991 boatI've been adding up costs, need, wants etcOriginal rigging and lifelines will need replacementNo current refrigerationNo electronics, autopilot, wind meter or anythingNo dodgerSeat and berth cushions need replacingNeed better cabin heat sourceWear and tear and TLC to bri png it back to conditionSo it's a combination between having a fairly simple boat for which we have fixed the major maintenance issues, and starting all over again. The time, the expense, the increased complexity has me nervous, not to mention year round having to keep her 2 hours away in the water instead of our backyardI wanted more comfort, practical galley, standing headroom, a head, storage space....I'm anxious that this is a can of worms and it stresses me out

 

[Dave N]

These old boats are really great. But the cost of fixing and replacing stuff is very very high. Get a real good handle on the boats needs and cost of same. Make certain that the price is adjusted in line with all of the items that will need attention. Sellers always think their boats are woth more than they are. If you can't get the price reduced enough, walk away. My anxiety always came from the fear of paying too much. You are in the drivers seat on that one. My two cents worth.

 

[Frank Langer]

I have owned three boats, each larger than the previous one. Prior to buying each new one I wondered if I could manage it, sail it on my own if my wife was busy with other things, dock it without doing damage, and maintain it as needed, sometimes knowing nothing about some parts (eg. diesel engine). But each time I was able to make the adjustment, but it took time crawling through the boat to explore the plumbing, electronics, etc. And I read lots of maintenance books, talked with people, hired out the tough jobs and watched so I could do it next time. Now I feel comfortable with the boat, know it well and can do all but the most serious maintenance on my own. I have replaced many parts, varnished lots, waxed lots, and spent lots of money.

If this sounds like what you are looking for, then get the best deal possible on the boat and buy it, after a good survey. If this sounds like more work than you are able to do, then maybe it's not the right thing for you.

Good luck whatever you decide!

Frank

 

[Loren Beach]

Well Said

I have owned three boats, each larger than the previous one. Prior to buying each new one I wondered if I could manage it, sail it on my own if my wife was busy with other things, dock it without doing damage, and maintain it as needed, sometimes knowing nothing about some parts (eg. diesel engine). But each time I was able to make the adjustment, but it took time crawling through the boat to explore the plumbing, electronics, etc. And I read lots of maintenance books, talked with people, hired out the tough jobs and watched so I could do it next time. Now I feel comfortable with the boat, know it well and can do all but the most serious maintenance on my own. I have replaced many parts, varnished lots, waxed lots, and spent lots of money.

If this sounds like what you are looking for, then get the best deal possible on the boat and buy it, after a good survey. If this sounds like more work than you are able to do, then maybe it's not the right thing for you.

Good luck whatever you decide!

Frank

At this point in this thread, a duck should descend with a sign! Frank really nailed it!


(Groucho Marx TV reference, for you youngsters...)

Loren

ps: Picture of one in this thread. http://www.ericsonyachts.org/infoex...ew-to-Ericson-(E-34T-questions)&referrerid=28
Is this like the Ericson in question?

 

[northerner]

Hi Loren, Frank and DaveI agree with what you say, thank you.The issue I'm having is that the owners are 'set' on obtaining their asking price. So if we pay the $1600 to get her surveyed, and it turns up a list of stuff to do, which is sort of inevitable, then we can't negotiate downThe boat feels absolutely huge to be as well, since we're used to sailing a pocket cruiser. I'm not sure for example we will do it without it being a total gong show

 

[Frank Langer]

I don't know your area, but $1600 for a survey sounds very expensive. Have you shopped around? Also, the owners may be firm on the price now, but if serious stuff shows on the survey, they may have to accept a new reality--no guarantee of course that they will be reasonable, but still a possibility.

I am also assuming that you have shopped around in the boat market and are sure that this is the best boat for you (not withstanding your anxiety) and it's the best price you can find anywhere for a boat in it's condition.

I am a firm believer that there is no single best boat, house, car, etc. when making a purchase like this. We've all had deals fall through that we thought were just right, only to have a better one come along a bit later. So if this one doesn't come together well for you, wait for a better one--for example, maybe an estate sale that wants to sell quickly at a reduced price, even though the boat is in great shape.

Good luck!

Frank

 

[Loren Beach]

survey quote

A survey from the best surveyor in our region would cost you $510. plus the cost of the haul out, in Portland, OR.
http://www.alisonmazon.com/

Heck, you just about fly the surveyor in to Alaska and back to Portland and almost come out ahead...
:0

Loren

 

[Mort Fligelman]

When to Walk away

I totally agree that $1600 is way out of line for a survey......assuming that it takes a full 8 hours to do, then $200 an hour means that the surveyor is getting what a highly skilled attorney, Dr. etc......I just don't buy it.

For what this is worth.....I know of a person who has had his boat up for sale for the past four years.....is asking way over what it is worth IMHO.....it is far from Bristol......he will not entertain any offer lower than his asking....he has exhausted more brokers than I care to count.....keeps putting money into the boat and it is still deteriorating as he is going only half measures as he really thinks he can sell it and these half measures only detract and not enhance the boat.

The point of all this being......if this is the mind set you are facing....walk away....my feeling....and if it smells like fish......something is not right....

All of the above of course is worth just what you are paying here.....$0.00.....but is the survey on a 2i year old boat worth $1600???????

Good Luck

 

[northerner]

Hi Loren, Frank and Mort

The $1600 includes his flight which is $220 return, plus, his time for getting there, which is 30 minutes each way. It doesn't include a haul out and bottom inspection which isn't available here. It does seem high to me, and I'm not sure why

We did find a boat that we both really liked, an Aloha 34 in BC. We sea trialed it last week in 35 knots and the performance was unbelievable. It was $7000 cheaper than the Ericson we're looking at now. It was also 7 years older. It had a brand new Volvo Penta engine, full electronics, news lifelines, new sails, etc. The good part of the story ends there. We were poking around the boat and noticed that there were black streaks coming down from the starboard stantions and chain plates, and there was black water in the port side locker behind the settee. When I asked about the water in the locker, the broker said it was molasses. When I asked the owner later why the cabin sole was delaminated, discolored and damaged in a number of places, he said it was caused by 'perspiration' from below. When the survey failed to turn up anything wrong, I hired another surveyor to go back over the areas we were concerned about. The inspection report made me sick - mast corrosion, rotten bulkheads, leaking chainplates, leaking toe rail, deck hull joint leaking...the list goes on and on. We spent over $3000 on the air fare, accommodations and 2 surveys to find out that the boat was likely salvage.

I like the Ericson 34, but I have some anxiety when we inspect and find out the rear cabin is soaked. We traced that to the rear locker in the cockpit leaking because of a thru hull fitting that had come off the propane tank. When the boat heeled, the locker filled with water. They had no idea where it was coming from so we diagnosed it and plugged the fitting to stop it leaking. We then noticed that the bulkhead adjacent to the locker was rotten and needs to be replaced. The owners said they would fix that. There are a leaking port windows, and the trapeziod ones as well

I don't know if our experiences are normal or if we've just been unlucky. My husband has spent the entire winter and every weekend for the last 3 months fixing rot in the S 2 and rebedding all deck fittings. He also did a complete rewire to fix the household wiring that is in the boat

I want another boat, but not at any cost. At a price of $55,000 and throwing another $20,000 on top of it, plus all the maintenance and fixing issues, I'm starting to get cold feet. Since there are few boats for sale in our area, the only other option is to buy south and bring it the 1500 miles up. But the travel adds up fast to view and survey boats, and our brokerage experience leaves me a bit cold. Travel to this area is about $1000 return to bring a surveyor up from the south

I dunno, it's all a muddle

 

[Loren Beach]

55k

By "lower 48" standards, that's an amazing price!
A decent early 80's Ercson 38 appears about to sell in Portland this week for about $40 to 44K.
Perhaps there's a summer trip up the inside passage in your new used boat, in your future?

Loren

 

[northerner]

Loren, is amazing good or bad?

 

[Loren Beach]

Loren, is amazing good or bad?

If you're the seller, [I wonderful![/I]

But it really depends on what year that Ericson is. The late 70's E-34T and the late 80's E-34 are completely different boats.
A late model one might go for over 50K in really good condition, even in this market.

Loren

 

[October55]

I should have shipped my E34 North!

My 1987 E34 is listed at Vela Yacht Sales in Victoria, BC. It has an offer on it and has had the survey. If all goes well with the mechanical inspection and sea trial it may be sold. It was listed at $49,900 CAD. It wont sell for anywhere near that amount when one considers the commission and small repairs that resulted from the survey. If I could have gotten $55K it would have been worth while to sail it to Alaska!!