I need some help identifying this on my 1987 38-200

[Synchronicity]

There is a plastic tube in oil pan area immediately under the engine. (32hp Universal 5432)

Here is the best pic I could get. What is the function of this tube? Where does it come from and where does it go?

I have a mystery problem. I am collecting water in the oil pan area under the engine. After I pump the water out and wipe the pan dry, you can actually watch the water slowly seeping back in. This happens all the time. In water or on the hard. I had added the pink antifreeze to the water tanks and primed it through the tubing. There is green antifreeze in the engine water. The water collecting in the pan is crystal clear. (I am not salty or desperate enough to do the 'taste the bilge water' trick...)

The water seems to trickle in to a certain level and then stop. I mean that after a day or two I have an inch or so water in the pan. If I leave it and come back a week later, I have an inch or so in the pan. Drain it, and the next day I have an inch of water in the pan. Recent rainfall does not seem to have any effect. This is all pretty subjective, and I could be mistaken.

But the facts are:
1. Water is getting into the pan.
2. After draining, it will refill within 24 hrs.
3. If never seem to overflow the pan.
4. This has been going on for months.
5. I am clueless...

I have attached the pics.

Any help is greatly appreciated. Thanks.

 

[bsangs]

Was wondering if the green was coolant, but you said the water is crystal clear, so never mind. (Won't let me completely erase the message I previously posted.) You should do a quick finger taste test. Won't kill you. I've sampled many boat substances like that. Might have a leaking shaft seal.

 

[bigd14]

On my 30+ that same limber tube exists. Its purpose is to move any water collecting aft of the engine through the built in "drip pan" under the engine and routing it to the main bilge. This prevents any oil or diesel drips coming from the engine from contaminating the bilge water. Looks like the limber tube may not be sealed where it passes through the TAFG and is leaking water into the drip pan. So, check the stern area for leaks. Shaft seal, pedestal, dorades, etc.

 

[Synchronicity]

Yes, green colored antifreeze. The coolant level has remained constant of the winter and there is no trace of any green color in the water in the pan. If you look closely at IMG_0030.jpeg, you can see clear water in the bottom of the pan. Also this has been going on since before and after I hauled the boat. I hauled on Dec 1, and it is still collecting water in the pan every time I drain it, so it can't be a leaking shaft seal.

I have a PSS shirt seal that normally is pretty dry, although I imagine they can develop leaks. I can't believe they actually work as well as they do and the boat still floats...

 

[bigd14]

I have a PSS shirt seal that normally is pretty dry,

Does the main bilge compartment have water in it that might back up to that level? Maybe its coming from the raw water cooling system on the engine? Do you keep the raw water seacock closed?

 

[bsangs]

Yes, green colored antifreeze. The coolant level has remained constant of the winter and there is no trace of any green color in the water in the pan. If you look closely at IMG_0030.jpeg, you can see clear water in the bottom of the pan. Also this has been going on since before and after I hauled the boat. I hauled on Dec 1, and it is still collecting water in the pan every time I drain it, so it can't be a leaking shaft seal.

I have a PSS shirt seal that normally is pretty dry, although I imagine they can develop leaks. I can't believe they actually work as well as they do and the boat still floats...

Are you in freshwater, saltwater, or brackish water? That's where the taste test comes in handy.

The shaft seals do develop leaks, depending on age. Had to replace mine last year, and what you're experiencing seems similar to what was happening to me. I'd inspect it pretty closely, just to be safe.

Also could be a leaky rudder tube. Have had that as well. So many "could be" possibilities. Boat ownership is fun.

 

[Synchronicity]

On my 30+ that same limber tube exists. Its purpose is to move any water collecting aft of the engine through the built in "drip pan" under the engine and routing it to the main bilge. This prevents any oil or diesel drips coming from the engine from contaminating the bilge water. Looks like the limber tube may not be sealed where it passes through the TAFG and is leaking water into the drip pan.

That was my guess. I am thinking that the only way to get this fixed is to raise the engine $$$, which is a real kick in the butt, because I just had the oil drain plug replaced 6 months ago, which required raising the engine... Thanks for your reply.

I guess I need to pull everything out of the cockpit locker and find the aft end of that limber tube, if that's even possible. I suspect rain water is getting in somehow and collecting aft of the engine in one the depressions formed by the TAFG (Tri Axial Force Grid - sorry, I am compulsive about acronyms...)

I hate leaks...

"One day I will find that secret bar where all the sailboat designers gather and laugh about how cleverly they wedged critical features into inaccessible places. And when I do, I promise you they will suffer...."

 

[Synchronicity]

Are you in freshwater, saltwater, or brackish water? That's where the taste test comes in handy.

The shaft seals do develop leaks, depending on age. Had to replace mine last year, and what you're experiencing seems similar to what was happening to me. I'd inspect it pretty closely, just to be safe.

Also could be a leaky rudder tube. Have had that as well. So many "could be" possibilities. Boat ownership is fun.

Thanks for the reply. The leak is the same in the water or on jack stands ashore. I feel I can rule out Chesapeake Bay water incursion!

 

[bigd14]

I wouldn't go to the trouble of raising the engine again. Put a sheet or two of oil absorbent under the engine to collect drips and try not to worry about it. Finding the source of the water should fix the issue.

 

[bsangs]

Thanks for the reply. The leak is the same in the water or on jack stands ashore. I feel I can rule out Chesapeake Bay water incursion!

My fault for reading too quickly. Glossed right over the part of it also happening on the hard. Well that should make it "easier" on you. Good luck.

 

[Nick J]

I'm not familiar with the -200 series, but on my 35-3 there's a hull liner in the aft section that overlaps the engine bed portion of the TAFG. The entrance to this tube was under the liner and I couldn't access it until I cut the section out. The pan below the engine isn't a single fiberglass piece. It's formed from the TAFG being tabbed to the hull. I can see how there could be voids in the tabbing that could allow water trapped in the TAFG to seep out into the engine pan. Sources for rain water in the aft section of my boat are the two vents on the stern rail and the cockpit combing box. There's some pictures of the area on my boat on this thread:

Engine Compartment Clean up

Wow! The picture of the recently-vacated engine bay looks a lot like ours did, well into our engine replacement project. I hope your blog entries are better-detailed than mine were. Thanks again for sharing. The cleanup work is well worth the time, imho. :)

ericsonyachts.org

It's frustrating that the engine pan isn't doing it's job anymore, but I would do what @bigd14 suggests and just keep an eye on it. any permanent fix would require either working in a tight spot under the engine or removing it and I don't think it's worth it.

You might also check your raw water pump to see if one of the seals is going bad and the pan is filling up to a leak in the tabbing where it can spill over to the main bilge.

 

[Kenneth K]

Like bigd said, that tube connects the stern area to the bilge area, allowing water to transit the engine pan without mixing with oil and grease that the engine pan may collect. We've seen differences between boats, but there should also be a drain channel (along the hull) below the TAFG and below the engine pan. Here is what mine looks like.





If yours is similar, it may just be that the caulk around the pvc tube is allowing water (from aft) forward into the engine pan. Still, I would want to know where the the water is coming from and why it is collecting up by the drain tube rather than running below the TAFG along the hull.

 

[Synchronicity]

I'm not familiar with the -200 series, but on my 35-3 there's a hull liner in the aft section that overlaps the engine bed portion of the TAFG. The entrance to this tube was under the liner and I couldn't access it until I cut the section out. The pan below the engine isn't a single fiberglass piece. It's formed from the TAFG being tabbed to the hull. I can see how there could be voids in the tabbing that could allow water trapped in the TAFG to seep out into the engine pan. Sources for rain water in the aft section of my boat are the two vents on the stern rail and the cockpit combing box. There's some pictures of the area on my boat on this thread:

Engine Compartment Clean up

Wow! The picture of the recently-vacated engine bay looks a lot like ours did, well into our engine replacement project. I hope your blog entries are better-detailed than mine were. Thanks again for sharing. The cleanup work is well worth the time, imho. :)

ericsonyachts.org

It's frustrating that the engine pan isn't doing it's job anymore, but I would do what @bigd14 suggests and just keep an eye on it. any permanent fix would require either working in a tight spot under the engine or removing it and I don't think it's worth it.

You might also check your raw water pump to see if one of the seals is going bad and the pan is filling up to a leak in the tabbing where it can spill over to the main bilge.

Thanks. Those pics helped me understand how things are set up.

 

[southofvictor]

I’d taste it to eliminate the possibility it’s a raw water leak from the engine. If it’s fresh I’d start looking for leaks in the cockpit area. On our 38-200 everything aft of the companionway drains into the space aft of the engine and is pretty easy to see under the shaft by the seal. Do you have the aft engine under the companionway or engine under the galley model?

 

[Christian Williams]

Here's a view of the drip pan tube on my 1984 E381. I suppose water from the TAFG could seep in, as Nick J. suggests.

I'd probably empty the pan and then pour colored water under the cockpit, to see if that collects in the drip pan on its way to the bilge.

It does sound like rainwater or possibly a pressure water leak. If so, you'll can either fix the leak, or the pan, or both.