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E32-3 keel/hull connection

Captain C

Junior Member
I just had a 1985 E32-3 surveyed and I was hoping someone could give me some insight on the keel/hull connection. There is the very common “smile” at the connection, but this “smile” runs the full circumference of the keel.

The surveyor said I should definitely get this fixed. Either fair a v along the line and fill or lossen the bolts and rebed the keel.

I’m not sure if this is the surveyor being overly cautious and covering himself from a potential problem, even though the likihood is small, or if this is an immediate, real concern.

it does look like water is weeping from a few spots along this line.

I do do have a picture, but I’m not quite sure how to include it.

any insight is appreciated
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author

Captain C

Junior Member
Thanks Christian for the link on uploading a picture. Can’t quite figure out how to rotate photo but I’ll work on that. Problem is certainly attributed to my computer illiteracy and not your directions!
 

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Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Orient photo correctly on desktop and save before uploading.

1rotate.jpd.jpg

That looks to me like a typical fairing compound gap created by the usual flex of lead and hull. The drip is just trapped water coming out and the fix is to clean and fair again.

I would interrogate the surveyor, as in "If it was your boat what would you do?" Re-fairing is a hundred bucks, dropping the keel is many thousands.
 
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Frank Langer

1984 Ericson 30+, Nanaimo, BC
Captain C,

You ask a difficult question. Our 1984 E30+ hit a mostly submerged log, and afterwards showed a crack in the keel hull joint from the front of the keel back about a foot. There was no sign of water in the bilge. I decided to haul the boat to have it checked. The local experts put a lot of sideways pressure on the keel while it was in the sling, and it showed a few drips of water out of that forward crack--but the experts said that any water coming out of a crack in the keel hull joint required dropping the keel to fix it right. They said they could grind it a bit and fair it with epoxy, but said it wouldn't hold for long given the pressure on the keel.

I decided to listen to them and proceeded to have the keel dropped (mast had to be removed to avoid the boat becoming top heavy in the yard). The keel dropped readily with no damage to the joint--it was the easiest they said they had ever seen. I have read elsewhere on this site that Ericson did not remove the mould wax from the joint and caulked it quite badly on many Ericsons, meaning that the joint was not well-sealed. My experience certainly bore that out.

Fortunately, the keel bolts showed only very minor corrosion and were fine once cleaned with a wire brush. The yard staff gave me the choice of caulking with a Sikaflex type sealant or with epoxy. I chose epoxy cause I don't ever expect to have to remove the keel again. They slathered epoxy on top of the keel, then dropped the boat onto the keel, which squished epoxy up through the keel bolts. They said that even without the keel bolts and nuts, the keel would never fall off, but we did apply and tighten the keel bolt nuts.

Although the work was expensive, I'm confident that the joint will not leak, the keel bolts will not corrode and my mast and spreaders got a good inspection and lubrication where needed while it was down.

One option would be to just grind/fair the joint and see if it holds; if not, you could drop and rebed the keel at a future haulout.

Good luck, and let us know what you decide.

Frank
 

Hanktoo

Member III
Keel

if you are getting it surveyed i assume she is not yours and therefore not your problem. The solution seems easy
 

GrandpaSteve

Sustaining Member
I agree. Mine was like this but worse when I bought it. Re-faired it and has been no problem in five years.

Orient photo correctly on desktop and save before uploading.

View attachment 23758

That looks to me like a typical fairing compound gap created by the usual flex of lead and hull. The drip is just trapped water coming out and the fix is to clean and fair again.

I would interrogate the surveyor, as in "If it was your boat what would you do?" Re-fairing is a hundred bucks, dropping the keel is many thousands.
 

Filkee

Sustaining Member
B5066E6E-974B-4633-B174-1C8AB5D40BCE.jpgThis was my 32-3 when I bought her. Surveyor said the bolts looked fine from above and as he suggested, I gouged out the gap with a can opener (or maybe a more dignified tool than that) and re-filled it with a tube of 610. One of the more gratifying repairs of my first season.
 

Captain C

Junior Member
Thanks for all the replies and insight. The knowledge and willingness to help form members of this site is one of the reasons that sold me on Ericsons. I spend hours looking at information available here. I used to be a C&C owner and they have what I thought was an informative owners website. It doesn't even come close to information contained here. Truly Amazing.


Anyway, I got the official survey...it said..."Molded lead fin bolted to short keel stub. Seam beginning to show separation along most of the length. Forward corner has slight gouging from impact. OBSERVATIONS: monitor the keel/hull joint for opening and repair as needed."

He did not list this issue under "Immediate Attention" or "Recommendations" which is somewhat comforting. Observations are defined as..."These are descriptions of conditions noted that affect the survey. Typically, no correction is required at this time, however these items should be monitored for future consideration."

Otherwise boat surveyed well with just a few minor issues.

Hopefully I'm an Ericson owner soon.

Thanks again to all.
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Very good. As you progress, eyeball the existing alternator bracket arm. The old design was subject to failure and damage to the engine. The replacement arm goes "under" not "over." It's an easy fix confined to this particular engine, but some owners never got the word. Should look like this:

1-IMG_3177.JPG
 

RHenegar

Member I
Tighten Keel Bolts

I had the same issue on my "87 E32. Upon inspection I found that the nut on the forward keel bolt was rusted out. That bolt is difficult to see as it sit in the bilge in front of the mast so there is no direct access to it. You have to go in through the inspection port in the forward storage area of the settee to see it (A smartphone camera is a great inspection tool). For reasons I can't explain, out of 8 keel bolts only that one nut and washer was rusted, and none of the others show anything more than surface tarnish. And fortunately the stud didn't appear to be damaged, so I replaced the washer and nut, applying a generous amount of 3M 5200 around the base of the nut and then torqued the nut down. BTW, to get a socket on that nut you first reach way down through the settee opening and put the socket on the the nut, then remove a small piece of trim on the forward side of the base of the mast where you will find a small hole. Insert a long socket extension through the hole into the top of the socket. Then with the limited space available you can tighten and torque the nut.(The engineer who thought this was a good arrangement was leaning a little too heavy on the rum! Of course after this project was over I had to reciprocate.). Somewhere I read that the 1" keel bolts should be torqued to 350 Lb.ft., so I went ahead and re-torqued all keel bolts. Most were well below 350 lbs of torque. Apparently they are supposed to be re-torqued periodically. I guess once ever 30 years counts. I have also read somewhere that an inadequate amount of bedding compound was used between the keel and hull when the boat was built. Someday soon I plan to have the keel dropped and rebedded. Probably during the next bottom job. I have attached some photos of the project.

IMG_0516.JPGIMG_0518.JPGIMG_0524.JPGIMG_0527.JPG
 

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Geoff H

New Member
Keel

Rick

Thanks for those pictures of the forward keel bolt. I just purchased a 1986 32 III and I would like to replace that nut like you did. Did you do those repairs out of the water or was the boat pulled out and on the hard?

thanks Geoff


I had the same issue on my "87 E32. Upon inspection I found that the nut on the forward keel bolt was rusted out. That bolt is difficult to see as it sit in the bilge in front of the mast so there is no direct access to it. You have to go in through the inspection port in the forward storage area of the settee to see it (A smartphone camera is a great inspection tool). For reasons I can't explain, out of 8 keel bolts only that one nut and washer was rusted, and none of the others show anything more than surface tarnish. And fortunately the stud didn't appear to be damaged, so I replaced the washer and nut, applying a generous amount of 3M 5200 around the base of the nut and then torqued the nut down. BTW, to get a socket on that nut you first reach way down through the settee opening and put the socket on the the nut, then remove a small piece of trim on the forward side of the base of the mast where you will find a small hole. Insert a long socket extension through the hole into the top of the socket. Then with the limited space available you can tighten and torque the nut.(The engineer who thought this was a good arrangement was leaning a little too heavy on the rum! Of course after this project was over I had to reciprocate.). Somewhere I read that the 1" keel bolts should be torqued to 350 Lb.ft., so I went ahead and re-torqued all keel bolts. Most were well below 350 lbs of torque. Apparently they are supposed to be re-torqued periodically. I guess once ever 30 years counts. I have also read somewhere that an inadequate amount of bedding compound was used between the keel and hull when the boat was built. Someday soon I plan to have the keel dropped and rebedded. Probably during the next bottom job. I have attached some photos of the project.

View attachment 23828View attachment 23829View attachment 23830View attachment 23832
 

Loren Beach

O34 - Portland, OR
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Rick's last activity on the site was 9-9-18. Best click on his name and choose a direct contact option.
 
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