E 38 Auto pilot

I would like to know what auto pilots people are using on their E-38's? I see the weight of the boat being "borderline" for a wheel pilot. I also anticipate that the weight issue may be made greater when the boat is fully laden for a trip of a few weeks or more at a time. However, I like the wheel pilot simplicity and ease of repair not to mention material cost and installation costs as compared to a below deck model. Is anyone else using a wheel type on their 38? If so what make and model? If you are using a below decks I would ask the same make and model. Please let me know the pro's and con's of your particular unit also. Thanks in advance!!!

Autohelm ST4000 Wheelpilot

It is a 1990s vintage with flux gate compass and no rudder position transducer. I use it for heading hold duty when motoring rather than holding an angle to the wind. It is a bit noisy and once in a while it wanders off course - possibly due to "local magnetic disturbances." I haven't bothered to try tracking that down. It is very convenient to use and everything is hanging out in the open if maintenance is needed.

I also have a ST-4000. It is primarily used for motoring although the self tacking feature is handy while single handing. The primary problem with it is it is constantly correcting which is both irritating and uses a lot of power. On the whole, it holds course under power and sail well. I haven't tried it with the spinnaker. I suspect it will be too slow with the corrections for good steering. There's one of those magnetic disturbances in Haro Straights off San Juan Island.

I too have the exact same AP installed 6 years ago. I have used it on a few deliveries up and down the coast of WA.motoring and motor/sailing (30plus hour trips) with no issues. I would say it is simple to install easy to work on if needed and as some one said a great extra hand . if I were to do extended offshore sailing I would for sure add a wind vane.

We also have an ST4000. It's great for motoring in calm conditions, reasonable for sailing in moderate conditions (especially when set to the wind rather than compass), and poor in rougher conditions. Adding a rudder position sensor and adjusting sensitivity settings improved the performance a bit. Nonetheless, for serious offshore work the E38 should have both a high quality below deck unit primarily used for motoring or shifty wind conditions and a mechanical self steering wind vane for most sailing. Ryan L has described his setup on Naoma on this forum, which is great for the 38.

Mike Jacker

SmartPilot X-5

We have the Raymarine SmartPilot X-5 on a 38-200 and it works fine. We sail Sea of Cortez for about 5 months a year, and it has no problems handling the conditions there while boat is LOADED for extended cruising. That being said we watch weather carefully and have rarely been caught in really rough conditions and when we are we trust a person more than the pilot. It does have a sensitivity adjustment that does save on batteries, but it DOES use power, so at night crossings we often need to use engine to charge batteries, during day solar panels keep up with everything

Joliba said:

We also have an ST4000. It's great for motoring in calm conditions, reasonable for sailing in moderate conditions (especially when set to the wind rather than compass), and poor in rougher conditions. Adding a rudder position sensor and adjusting sensitivity settings improved the performance a bit. Nonetheless, for serious offshore work the E38 should have both a high quality below deck unit primarily used for motoring or shifty wind conditions and a mechanical self steering wind vane for most sailing. Ryan L has described his setup on Naoma on this forum, which is great for the 38.

Mike Jacker

Click to expand...

Ditto. We also had a ST4000, and it worked just fine for motoring on deliveries across the Great Lakes, and it even worked for short periods of sailing. But it was overwhelmed by rough conditions, enough that I would not consider offshore work with it. The real benefit was that it was small and easy to access, and I even had an entire spare set as back ups that I purchased from another sailor on this forum who upgraded to a below deck unit.

Our mechanical autopilot is an Octopus hydraulic linear drive coupled to a Simrad brain. Our wind vane is a Monitor. Both have worked incredibly well over 11,000 miles in the past few years with the exception of some frayed lines on the Monitor during long passages (not the Monitor's fault). The Octopus drive has needed zero maintenance so far and the Simrad autopilot is incredible. Quiet, responsive, easy to install and use, reliable so far. The downside is cost, this set up is not the cheapest available option, but if you're doing any "serious" sailing it is a setup that may serve you well.

St4000

A ST4000 is fitted to my 38', PO installed. I am not particularly happy with it as it occasionally wanders and then overcorrects under both motor and sail, power consumption is always a thing to think about whatever course you take (pun intended) I have not looked into the wandering as I am only using it for short periods of time. When I do however intend to head cruising, I will be getting a below deck 'George' - Auto-pilot, to be decided when time and monies allow.

Hammy in sunny Bermuda
Merrimist E38-200

My opinion is that unless you are crossing oceans a Raymarine EV-100 is all you need. Cheap, DIY installation, works for all motoring and sailing up to 15 knots or big waves).

You won't need more batteries or a solar farm for day sailing because the draw is 2 amps/hour under usual conditions, and when motoring the draw is irrelevant.

Pendulum wind vanes are marvelous expensive things but make no sense at all unless heading offshore. They need to be reset after every course change, require specific sail plans, and don't work at all when motoring in no wind.

If you can set up the boat on any course for minimal steering correction, the EV-100 will have no problem with a loaded E38. It is easy to make the test: go sailing and feel the helm. IN typical conditions, if the boat won;t go in a straight line without actual work wrestling the wheel, a wheel pilot will be overwhelmed and shut itself off).

But what happens if you put in a reef and reduce the genny a little? If the helm becomes easy, the wheel pilot can take over again.

Think of them as a talented 8-year-old pram sailor. Sure, when the wind comes she calls for help. But most of them it leaves dad free to do other stuff.

If the kid squeaks, pour fresh water into the hole in the drive belt housing, which is what it's there for. Salt crystals are the culprit.

This rather clumsy video shows me making all the mistakes possible with a new Ray wheel pilot five years ago. Mostly that was ignoring sail trim and failing to provide a fairly neutral helm.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0eP6iVFniHM

Christen!
Just the man I was hoping to discuss a few thing with. First, I would like to offer my congratulations on your recent trip. Kudos to you! I and many others followed you while en-route. Back to the auto pilot. I am currently planning to sail to Ireland upon my retirement in 7 years. I want to take the Northern route , get to Ireland then head South down the coast toward the Med. coastal hoping along the way and then return on the southern route. It is a dream I have had since childhood and I just can't shake it. In the meantime I am doing one major upgrade per year to The Optimist II. This season it is the auto pilot. As most or 1/2 of the voyage will most likely be solo the autopilot is of great importance. Next year I am adding solar panels then chart plotter and then wind vane then radar (maybe). From what I have read on this and other forums it would seem that below decks would be the prudent choice as some of the responses and manufacturers guides indicate the above deck model is at its "working limit" if you were to add loaded cruising weight and adverse weather/ waves. I understand and agree with your idea that with the proper sail configuration the boat should never be over taxed and the unit you have should be able to handle most or all of the steering. If you were doing the trip I plan on doing, and as we both have the same boat, which unit would you use? I respect your opinion and grant it a lot of weight.
I would also like to talk to you about battery banks, solar power, alternator type and manufacturer and many more items at another time. I look forward to your and everyone else's responses. Thanks in advance!
P.S I also put in fuel tank access ports shortly after you did yours in preparation.

Christen!
Just the man I was hoping to discuss a few thing with. First, I would like to offer my congratulations on your recent trip. Kudos to you! I and many others followed you while en-route. Back to the auto pilot. I am currently planning to sail to Ireland upon my retirement in 7 years. I want to take the Northern route , get to Ireland then head South down the coast toward the Med. coastal hoping along the way and then return on the southern route. It is a dream I have had since childhood and I just can't shake it. In the meantime I am doing one major upgrade per year to The Optimist II. This season it is the auto pilot. As most or 1/2 of the voyage will most likely be solo the autopilot is of great importance. Next year I am adding solar panels then chart plotter and then wind vane then radar (maybe). From what I have read on this and other forums it would seem that below decks would be the prudent choice as some of the responses and manufacturers guides indicate the above deck model is at its "working limit" if you were to add loaded cruising weight and adverse weather/ waves. I understand and agree with your idea that with the proper sail configuration the boat should never be over taxed and the unit you have should be able to handle most or all of the steering. If you were doing the trip I plan on doing, and as we both have the same boat, which unit would you use? I respect your opinion and grant it a lot of weight.
I would also like to talk to you about battery banks, solar power, alternator type and manufacturer and many more items at another time. I look forward to your and everyone else's responses. Thanks in advance!
P.S I also put in fuel tank access ports shortly after you did yours in preparation.

Pretty straightforward for your voyage.

You can choose a real autopilot, which will work with wind or without (Ryan Levinson wrote up his installation here), or a wind vane plus a wheel pilot.

The rigs costs more or less the same, so it's really a matter of how robust you're making the electrical system and whether you'll have solar panels or a generator.

Wind vanes are basically infallible mechanical systems. Autopilots, well, the people who have them know how to fix them. And they're well tested in the real world.

My wind vane will be for sale soon. I'll be asking $3K. A new Sailomat 800 is $5500, a Monitor is a little more. There are other choices, as in any religious war.

A full crew doesn't really need self-steering, but it makes life easier.

At some point in a gale no self-steering works, so self-steering isn't really a safety issue.