Time to haul out.

Time to haul out. New laws, new paints?

So I was planing to haul out at my favorite yard, Marina Shipyard in Long Beach, CA. In the past I was always able to save a few $ by doing all the sanding, prep and blister repair myself. Well the Marina Shipyard told me that as of last week they were contacted by California Department of Boating and Waterways and were informed that boat owners are no longer allowed to do their own prep / sanding because the toxic waste has to be controlled and disposed of by the Yard. Marina Shipyard did tell me that I could do my own painting though. In the past the Marina Shipyard has always suggested that they do the paint, and that it would be less expensive for me to let them do it, I am guessing in part by the fact that they buy the bottom paint in bulk.

So my question to you all is. does anyone know how many gallons I would need to cover the hull of my 1973 E-27. The last time (6 years ago) the Yard used Z-Spar bottom paint. To be honest I don't think it held up that well. Looks like Worst Marine is charging about $249.00 a gallon for Z-Spar Protector anti-fouling paint and Pettit Trinidad can cost up to $329.00 a gallon at WM.

So how many gallons do you think I need and any suggestions for other brands would greatly be appreciated. Has anyone tried the new bio friendly Pettit Bio-Coat paints I see being advertised in all the sailing magazines these days?

Hey Jeff,
1 gallon gives me two coats on my E27 - with a little extra to add to the high wear areas at the bottom of the can.

My personal preference is Pettit Hydrocoat (so far). However, I'm in the Sacramento Delta (some salt SF Bay sailing and mostly fresh to brackish). I have two years on my fist application of Hydorcoat (Previously Trinidad SR). So far it's working for me in my conditions. It's water soluble, ablative, inexpensive, and amazingly easy to apply. To get a smooth coat... it says to spray the hull with a hose prior to applying. I did it, and it works. My friends thought I was nuts. I will be hauling out this year so we'll see how it held up.

As with many things on sailboats -personal preference prevails. It's always interesting to hear what others are doing. Good luck.

G Kiba said:

Hey Jeff,
1 gallon gives me two coats on my E27 - with a little extra to add to the high wear areas at the bottom of the can.

My personal preference is Pettit Hydrocoat (so far). However, I'm in the Sacramento Delta (some salt SF Bay sailing and mostly fresh to brackish). I have two years on my fist application of Hydorcoat (Previously Trinidad SR). So far it's working for me in my conditions. It's water soluble, ablative, inexpensive, and amazingly easy to apply. To get a smooth coat... it says to spray the hull with a hose prior to applying. I did it, and it works. My friends thought I was nuts. I will be hauling out this year so we'll see how it held up.

As with many things on sailboats -personal preference prevails. It's always interesting to hear what others are doing. Good luck.

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Thanks for sharing your experience with Pettit Hydrocoat Grant. I wonder how well it will hold up in full blown salt water. I would prefer that it last about 5 years. I know, wishful thinking.

Jeff Asbury said:

Time to haul out. New laws, new paints?

So I was planing to haul out at my favorite yard, Marina Shipyard in Long Beach, CA. In the past I was always able to save a few $ by doing all the sanding, prep and blister repair myself. Well the Marina Shipyard told me that as of last week they were contacted by California Department of Boating and Waterways and were informed that boat owners are no longer allowed to do their own prep / sanding because the toxic waste has to be controlled and disposed of by the Yard. Marina Shipyard did tell me that I could do my own painting though. In the past the Marina Shipyard has always suggested that they do the paint, and that it would be less expensive for me to let them do it, I am guessing in part by the fact that they buy the bottom paint in bulk.

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Jeff,

I just hung up with *my* favorite yard, which is King Harbor Marine Center, and asked about this. He thinks what the guy at Marina Shipyard told you is complete B.S. At any rate, if you want to do your own prep work, including sanding, KHMC will let you do that. It is a bit of a trek from San Pedro, but then you get to have a killer sail home on that nice, clean bottom!

--Alan

Jeff Asbury said:

Time to haul out. New laws, new paints?

So I was planing to haul out at my favorite yard, Marina Shipyard in Long Beach, CA. In the past I was always able to save a few $ by doing all the sanding, prep and blister repair myself. Well the Marina Shipyard told me that as of last week they were contacted by California Department of Boating and Waterways and were informed that boat owners are no longer allowed to do their own prep / sanding because the toxic waste has to be controlled and disposed of by the Yard. Marina Shipyard did tell me that I could do my own painting though. In the past the Marina Shipyard has always suggested that they do the paint, and that it would be less expensive for me to let them do it, I am guessing in part by the fact that they buy the bottom paint in bulk.

<snip>

Click to expand...

Jeff,

I just hung up with *my* favorite yard, which is King Harbor Marine Center, and asked about this. He thinks what the guy at Marina Shipyard told you is complete B.S. At any rate, if you want to do your own prep work, including sanding, KHMC will let you do that. It is a bit of a trek from San Pedro, but then you get to have a killer sail home on that nice, clean bottom!

--Alan



</snip>

Alan Gomes said:

Jeff,

I just hung up with *my* favorite yard, which is King Harbor Marine Center, and asked about this. He thinks what the guy at Marina Shipyard told you is complete B.S. At any rate, if you want to do your own prep work, including sanding, KHMC will let you do that. It is a bit of a trek from San Pedro, but then you get to have a killer sail home on that nice, clean bottom!

--Alan



</snip>

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It wasn't a Guy, it was a Gal, Dawn. Have dealt with her for years. Can't imagine she would BS me. Hmm?

Jeff Asbury said:

It wasn't a Guy, it was a Gal, Dawn. Have dealt with her for years. Can't imagine she would BS me. Hmm?

Click to expand...

Well, Jeff, I don't know. Maybe KHMC just hasn't received the "visit" from CDBW yet. But regardless, if you want to do your own prep/sanding work, KHMC will still let you do it.

--Alan

Alan Gomes said:

Well, Jeff, I don't know. Maybe KHMC just hasn't received the "visit" from CDBW yet. But regardless, if you want to do your own prep/sanding work, KHMC will still let you do it.

--Alan

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Thanks Alan, but I already have plans to escort another friend and his boat down to Alamitos bay. Time is also a factor. It's only 1.5 hrs by water from San Pedro, vs about 4 hrs up wind & current to King Harbor.

Any thoughts about paint?

Jeff Asbury said:

Thanks Alan, but I already have plans to escort another friend and his boat down to Alamitos bay. Time is also a factor. It's only 1.5 hrs by water from San Pedro, vs about 4 hrs up wind & current to King Harbor.

Any thoughts about paint?

Click to expand...

Well, it depends on what you already have on the bottom; it needs to be compatible.

Anyway, if I recall correctly, I believe I went with Trinidad SR (or something equivalent). I know I made sure to get whatever had the highest cuprous oxide content (70%, if I remember right).

No more DIY in the yard.

Jeff & company, You about gave me a hart attack alerting us to your yard's new forced policy. I called The Boat Yard in Marina del Rey CA, the yard I've always used for decades and decades and they'd not heard of such a ruling. Now, does that mean that you've been given false information or is it just that Boating and Waterways just hasn't made it this far north up the coast yet? Time will tell, It'll easily be another four to six years before needing to get the bottom repainted. For what it's worth, two gallons of Petit Trinidad VOC at a staggering $270.00 per, is what I need to lay on two coats allowing for a bit left for a third coat at the waterline and the bow. Glyn

Now, does that mean that you've been given false information or is it just that Boating and Waterways just hasn't made it this far north up the coast yet?

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Do you really think they are personally visiting each boatyard to give them this information? I guess they haven't heard about the U. S. Postal Service...

Thanks for all your input Guys. Yes, I am researching other Shipyards. And may try to get more specific information from Marina Shipyard. Somethings Fishy, but hey, don't most Shipyards smell that way. I'll let you know what I find out.

Jeff, per the FB thread, I finally found my invoice for my bottom job but, sadly, the yard didn't say how many gallons I was charged for. Good luck researching other DIY yards in SoCal.

cheers,
Ike

s/v Skol
Berkeley, CA

1 Gal

Hi Jeff,

I also use Hydrocoat and yes 1 gallon gives me a full 2 coats with about a half a pint left over.

Don

Well I hauled out at Marina Shipyard last Friday. So here's the deal about how the Federal Clean Water Act and California Department of Boating and Waterways has cracked down on Marina Shipyard. If you call the office and ask if you can do your own work the answer will be no.

I talked with the owner Jerry Tretter on Saturday. Jerry Tretter is the 3rd generation owner. His Father, Bud Tretter not only owned Marina Shipyard, but he also used to own Colonial Shipyard in San Pedro which is now out of business (un related to environmental regulations). Jerry said Marina Shipyard now has to follow strict regulations and that his water run off will be tested regularly for contaminants. He thinks the reason that California Department of boating and waterways cracked down on Marina Shipyard first is because they are a high profile operation that is easily seen in Alamitos Bay. It is just a matter of time before all the other yards in So Cal will also have to abide by the new strict regulations. There is also OSHA. Jerry was really ticked off.

I got the impression that technically you probably could still do your own work, but most likely it will not be as cost effective as having the yard do it. And by them saying no, is strong discouragement. Jerry has to make sure you do it legally.

1) You have to cover the boat from the hull down with plastic on the ground as well.
2) There can be no trace of any of the old paint or other evidence of other contaminants remaining. You have to bring a vacuum.
3) You must wear a protective suite and a respirator.
4) Technically, you will have to get checked out by a Doctor to make sure you don't have pre existing respiratory conditions that could be made worse.
5) You can pay to have the yard properly dispose of the waste, or I assume you could do it at your own expense, but the yard would probably need proof of how you disposed of it so they are not liable.

Here's a example verbal quote I was given when I inquired about having all the old paint stripped off my boat and had the yard apply 2 coats of epoxy primer and two coats of bottom paint. Roughly $1,800. plus a $700. reclamation / disposal fee. Total $2,500. I would have been okay paying the $1,800. but that extra $700. just killed the deal. Well, a $2,500. bottom job is just not in my budget, or even a $1,800. job for that matter. So I just opted to have the yard sand down the peeling paint patches by hand and then apply new Z-Spar bottom paint. I got a approximate estimate of $1,300. but they can't give me a exact cost until the work is completed. The last time I hauled out there I spent two days doing all my own prep, painted the boot stripe myself and the fees for the bottom paint job and labor done by the yard was about $800.

I was able to paint my boot stripe on Saturday and that's how I got to talking with Jerry. While I was there on Saturday I watched as they were installing a special drainage / evaporation system that will help to control the run off of the toxins. This looked to be a expensive project. Jerry told me that all this pressure from California Department of Boating and Waterways had just come down six weeks prior. He also told me that in Northern California he knew of two yards that were put out of business and that is just a matter of time before all the yards in So Cal will have to be compliant. Jerry also pointed out how extreme these regulations have become by saying as the law is now, technically it is illegal to was your boat at any Marina. I also asked him about the coming restrictions of copper bottom paint and mandatory removal of the existing paint. He said that it is indeed coming.

Personally I have not the time to research all of what I was told, but I don't think I was hearing any BS. Owning a boat in California is about to get really expensive IMHO.

A couple YouTube clips of my boat hauling out:

http://youtu.be/83vjMCEd_Gw

http://youtu.be/0GNiMKcW55s