M25XP Corrosion - How bad is this?

Hello,

I'm a happy owner of 32-3 since this spring and this is my first post on this forum.
This is a great site and I was able to find answers to all my questions so far.

On Sunday I had some time to take a closer look at the engine, and found corrosion
around the raw water pump. There is no evidence of leak right now, but I see that it
has been sprayed with grey paint by the PO, so there might have been something.

I attached some pictures, maybe there's someone out there who had similar issues
and can tell me if I have to start looking for a new engine or a can of paint will do...

Peter

I don't like that amount of corrosion on the side of the block

Did the surveyor not have a flashlight? That pic of the front I'm not sure if that is part of the block or a replaceable part like motor mount without running out to my boat to get a closer look. That drain cock is in the open position right? How come coolant isn't flowing out? Anyway it's hard to tell but the layers of rust look deep.

I have a 32-3 in Port Jefferson.

Just realized you said Sunday, how many rainwater leaks did you find?

Honestly, I completely ignored that cock. But there is nothing flowing out there, now that you mentioned it I'm not sure if I want to turn it.

I'm afraid what you see is not the mount, it is the block.

As to the rain, I have solar vents in the hatches, one of them leaks, also the starboard cockpit locker and of course got water coming down the mast.

Engine "RUST"

Peter:

What I would do (and remember I said "I") would be to spray the engine with Iron Out or Rust A Way.......rinse it down and know just how bad it is.

As to the water pump, I replaced mine completely when going from salt to fresh water.......also, had the heat exchanger completely boiled out, all the gaskets replaced, and new zincs.....it is a possibility that the P/O did this with the various items painted grey.....could be a rust preventive primer....don't know.....but go over with a fine tooth comb.......

My guess would be that you can stop the corrosion in its tracks on the block with a product called "Extend"......as to the pump and heat exchanger....cheap compared to an engine.....

Just my thoughts....FWIW

Is the petcock open or not?

All, Curiously, I bought a small brass petcock for a vintage Craftsman wet stone I was restoring. I got to the point of installing it and to my utter amazement, when I turned the handle across the flow and I began pouring water in for my first test, I got water all over my jeans and shoes instead.
Incredulously, I rotated it in line with the water flow and that closed it, a first for this boy. Could it be the same on that Universal engine and others??? Glyn Judson, E31 hull #55, Marina del Rey, CA

Have no fear. From what I can see, you don't have anything you can't fix, assuming it runs. That's the good news. There's no bad news unless you don't like getting your hands dirty.

1. Paint: When I bought our boat in 1998, the engine looked like that except without all the gray paint. I personally am proud to say that I added pretty much the same gray paint to mine!!! Why? There signs of rust, so I cleaned and scrubbed and wire brushed and slapped on gray Rustoleum paint. I fully intended to repaint it all, even bought the expensive Westerbeke gold paint. Then I found out that GM Camel #286 is the same. I haven't painted it, yet, and it's been working fine for 13 years now.

2. Raw water pump: If it's leaking around it, just remove and either repair or replace it. One of the first things I had to do, too. Learn how the pumps work (internal seals). You can usually save the pump and just redo the seals, but many have found that the $$ to have someone else redo the seals = a new pump. Buy impeller replacements and gaskets, too. I replaced the whole pump. Good news, it's an Oberdorfer. Buy it less expensive than a Sherwood pump, and less than a Universal dealer 'cuz they're available elsewhere. If you need a reference, let us know, but a quick Google will find the source for you.

2a. Heat exchanger: Sendure is also your friend, do a search on our C34 'site or here and find out about your heat exchanger and easy to find gaskets, etc.

3. Petcock: Leave it, don't touch it, the fact that it's not leaking is GREAT NEWS. You can remove your coolant many other ways. That's there 'cuz they used to be tractor engines and were easy to get to. Leave it.

We have over 20 years of M25 information on our C34 website. Check out the links below, and come back if you have any questions.

FWIW, I KNOW exactly how you feel, 'cuz I went through the very same issues with my engine when we bought the boat. Been runnin' like a top ever since, in spite of me!

Engine wiki: http://www.c34.org/wiki/index.php?title=Diesel_Engine

"Critical Upgrades" with lotsa engine information: http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,5078.0.html

www.marinedieseldirect.com is your friend for other information, and our site has manuals, too, if you don't find them here.

That coolant petcock does work opposite of what you would expect. I would leave it alone as well. When I opened then closed mine it kept dripping, so I put a rubber cap on it...

Por 15

I have had some luck with products from por15. You might find one of these products helpful.

http://www.porstore.com/

good luck

Paul

Universal/Kubota engine blocks are so thick there is no way that rust is a serious problem. You have several options. Do nothing, your grandchildren may have a problem. Wire brush, coat with Fluid Film, it will prevent any further corrosion. Wire brush, degrease thoroughly, paint with good engine paint. POR15 makes a very high quality engine paint that you brush on. Or go whole hog, and do the whole POR15 process and topcoat. PITA, but the most complete way. RT

rwthomas1 said:

Universal/Kubota engine blocks are so thick there is no way that rust is a serious problem.

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Yep. Ours appeared worse than your pictures when we got it. I cleaned it up with a metal brush to make myself feel better. Only caveat is the rust had gotten to a bolt which sheered off when extracting it. Luckily it wasn't it in a critical high-load place (thermostat housing) and I was able to drill it out. If I ever have to try to pull out any of the "important" bolts its probably time for a new engine anyway. Knock on wood.

Thank you all for your great feedback, it's really reassuring to know so many of you have been there. Special thanks for Stu.

Although I sailed a quite a lot on bigger boats, I've never owned anything bigger than a 470 or Laser. During the Around Long Island Race on my friend's boat the engine dumped all the oil because of a rusted oil cooler (we were charging the batteries) and that experience probably made me a little overreacting this.

Looks like I'll go with what most of you recommended: wire brush, cleaning, probably one of the rust preventing products and paint (although I like Rob's 'do nothing' advice the best).

I hope the engine block is thick enough, what worries me a bit though is the corner where the timing cover is attached to the block, I guess a smaller amount of rust could cause a leak there sooner or later?

The gasket surfaces I have seen have been at least 1/2" or better so it would take a lot of rust to eat through that much cast iron. Now sheet steel, oil lines, etc. are another matter entirely. Any thin sheet steel, especially sheet steel that has been stamp/press formed seems especially prone to perforation from rust. A different matter entirely. Those items should be watched closely and rust proofed ASAP when you see a problem. Thick cast iron is less of an issue, IMHO. RT

The gasket surfaces tend to be the thickest parts of the block. In pictures 4&5 is the pet cock for draining coolant, the threaded area where the pet-cock threads is thicker than the surrounding area. The thinner area is the water jacket that's the area that concerns me.

Thanks guys, I'll wire brush the area and take a closer look this weekend.

I also recommend staying with NON-synthetic oil. Just regular 10W-30 or even straight 30W. 15W-40 Delo works fine, too.

Stu Jackson said:

I also recommend staying with NON-synthetic oil. Just regular 10W-30 or even straight 30W. 15W-40 Delo works fine, too.

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Just curious why you would make this recommendation? RT