E34 Pink Panther visit - what I learned (with pictures)

bertboyer · Mar 26, 2024

E34 Pink Panther visit - What I learned (with Pictures)

I visited this boat yesterday and for new readers you will see a previous thread where I discussed this boat with EY.o Forum members.

Here is the Yachtworld listing:

1988 Ericson 34 Racer/Cruiser for sale - YachtWorld

Find more information and images about the boat and contact the seller or search more boats for sale on YachtWorld.

www.yachtworld.com

Also note that another member posted about this boat a year ago and that thread can be found by searching for "Pink Panther"

Thanks for your comments and my apologies for not correctly attaching the photos on the first posting.

Bert

This is a single owner boat with no maintenance invoices. It was in a slip, so I know it floats I really liked the lines and the saloon and berths. I also like what I read in sailboat data. However, there are some issues I’d like to share, and get your opinions on...

The broker said the boat was only sailed in the Columbia River and maybe once to the Puget Sound. He thought he could get the engine hours. He said the boat was on the market for a long time (>2 years) as the owners were initially asking too much ($47K). According to the broker, the boat has not had a marine survey done on it. He said the hull needs painting as it was last painted about 3 years ago, and it has blisters.

The bow of the boat looked like it bumped the dock (see photo). I couldn’t inspect the keel, but the broker said it was in good shape (a marine survey and haul out will answer the question). Not sure if these things are related, but the bulkhead doors to the V berth don’t close. There is about a ¼ inch overlap (see pic). I couldn’t get to the bulkhead tabbing to inspect.

The main and jib sails are circa 1999. They were not raised for me in this visit, but appeared to be ok without fraying – I’m not a sail expert, so I could be way off on this one. The spinnaker sail is only 2-3 years old and rarely used.

The deck does have some crazing/gelcoat cracks, but they mostly appear in very small groupings. However, one area just aft of the anchor locker on the starboard side is slightly raised and sounds dull when tapped with the back of a screwdriver (see pic).

Likely delamination aft of anchor locker.jpeg

There is no windlass – a must (for us) for coastal cruising in the PNW.

There was no visible caulk around the toe rail or hatches. The bulwarks/deck joint looks fine to me and seems custom as others pointed out. All hatches and portlights open, the gaskets are supple and the plexiglass appears nice and clean (no crazing). Several portlights were replaced, and several of the rubber gaskets stuck to the plexiglass when opened. The V berth hatch was leaking above the bulkhead (see pic).

The stanchions appear sturdy, but most of the lifeline end fittings show rust (see picture). The mast seems straight with no visible dimples or ridges. The shrouds were a bit loose, but didn’t seem to move the spreaders. The chainplates seemed in good shape without caulking, rust or cracks in the gelcoat. No extra caulking around hatches, portlights or standing rigging plates. The running rigging seems a little frayed and old to me (see pic)

The helm steering wheel turns nicely and doesn’t seem to have any play in it. The Richie compass looks great, but all the electronics are old…as mentioned earlier. The winches seem in good shape (from listening to them when turned slowly). All canvas covers seem pretty nice and mostly stiff….but there was also light rain during our visit so everything was wet. Although there was some mold/moss on the cover above the companionway, it’s Portland where everything turns green in winter!

Down Below:

The interior wood and cabinetry looked very nice overall, clean counters, and nice upholstery. The ice boxes had little refrigeration/freezer pads added. The oven and stovetop hardly looked used. The bilges all had about an inch or two of water in them. The engine was very accessible, appeared clean to me with no oil drips, belt dust, or water (see pics). The batteries (2) were clean and without corrosion. The broker said we could do a cold start on the next visit. but there were a few issues I’d like to point out:

The V berth wood was moist under the cushions, so I inspected more...
The forward-most locker/storage area under the furthest forward V Berth cushion had water in it (see picture). I didn’t see water in the anchor locker above it, but I also didn’t take out the anchors, chain, and rode to look further as it was raining.
The sole just aft of the bulkhead had water stains (see pictures). The broker said it was from a leaky hatch that has been replaced.
The bulkhead doors to the V berth not aligned as mentioned earlier.
The head looked pretty clean (no smell), but there was a pink fluid near the base of the toilet and to the left of it (see picture).
The keel bolts were corrosion free, but in about an inch of water. There was one bilge pump and one manual pump.
----------------------------------------------------

Overall, our first feeling/assessment.

We liked the lines of the E34 a lot. The saloon was extremely well kept, comfortable and well designed. We could definitely enjoy sailing in the PNW with an E34…BUT, it seems like there are quite a few major maintenance issues addressed earlier, and I don’t even have a marine survey yet. Are the level of these concerns typical of a 36 year old boat? Should I keep looking for something better or proceed with a marine survey?

I’d really appreciate your thoughts.

All the best,
Bert

frick · Mar 26, 2024

I would not make up my mind until the survey is done
Rick

Christian Williams · Mar 26, 2024

The V berth wood was moist under the cushions, so I inspected more...
The forward-most locker/storage area under the furthest forward V Berth cushion had water in it (see picture).

I would point this out to the surveyor. The leak needs identification. Could be the hatch, deck fittings, even the drain hose of the anchor rode pan (inspect with a flashlight from V-berth).

The cabin sole discoloration is consistent with leaking main hatch. If the wood isn't soft, it's just cosmetic. If rotten, the sole (floor) will need replacement, which is a labor job.

Leaking main hatches can often be fixed with new gaskets, and leaking portlights typically need rebedding. I'd say all of us have dealt with that.

reginaldobaker · Mar 26, 2024

I’m no expert but from a quick read through nothing seems like an immediate deal breaker, personally. A lot of this stuff seems common for a boat that’s been “for sale” for years: dirty running rigging, water stains, etc.
The leak from the foreword hatch is something I dealt with myself this past summer - remove and rebed.

probably preaching to the PNW choir here but the seasonal wetness can be a catch-22. If you visit when it’s wet you’ll likely see all the leaky spots, but there may be a lot of additional condensation around anyway.

would the broker be open to running a passive heater inside for a couple days before the next visit? A cold start on the engine, and of course surveys, will be very helpful.

from everything that was mentioned thus far it seems the good outweighs the bad (no obvious structural problems).

bertboyer · Mar 26, 2024

reginaldobaker said:
I’m no expert but from a quick read through nothing seems like an immediate deal breaker, personally. A lot of this stuff seems common for a boat that’s been “for sale” for years: dirty running rigging, water stains, etc.
The leak from the foreword hatch is something I dealt with myself this past summer - remove and rebed.

probably preaching to the PNW choir here but the seasonal wetness can be a catch-22. If you visit when it’s wet you’ll likely see all the leaky spots, but there may be a lot of additional condensation around anyway.

would the broker be open to running a passive heater inside for a couple days before the next visit? A cold start on the engine, and of course surveys, will be very helpful.

from everything that was mentioned thus far it seems the good outweighs the bad.

Thanks for your comments. There were two small space heaters running when we visited. The broker said it was fine to do a cold start on my second visit, as well as to raise the sails for closer inspection.

Right now I am weighing whether to proceed with a marine survey, so your comments and feedback from other from members on the forum will be very helpful to me in making this important decision. My first impressions were that I liked many things about the boat, but as my visit progressed, I became concerned about all the deferred maintenance.

Note to all: I am a newbie to sailing (~80 hrs) and this was the first boat I looked at. However, I am trying to sail as much as possible, I'm taking more sailing courses this summer, and want to retire or semi-retire in the next 3-5 years and it was nice to see a single-owner boat in fresh water that didn't appear to have major structural damage (to my untrained eye).

I appreciate the insight and guidance you and others on this forum are willing to provide to a prospective Ericson owner!

ConchyDug · Mar 26, 2024

$39k? Hell no at that price. That is overpriced. 25yr old sails are toast, sure you can sail with them but they are bagged out and you'll probably find out real quick what UV exposure over 25yrs has weakened on them, those safety lines are toast and not safe, most racing safety requirements don't allow coated safety lines anymore for a reason(you can't inspect the coated sections). If it's the vberth access door that's not closing and the rigging seems loose I'd check tensions to see if something was over or under tensioned causing the boat to be twisted weird. Also why is the rigging loose? Looks like original rigging? That's a pretty old backstay adjuster, I'd be surprised if it held pressure. Exhaust leak right before the elbow? New starter? I could keep going but in my opinion the boat is definitely not worth $39k I think you have a lot of wiggle room on price.. I've seen lowball cash offers work on forgotten boats like this, it's worth a shot if you really want the boat. Old boats that you can tell have been sitting for years are a headache though. If you can find one that is currently being cared for it'd be a much better buy. I'd definitely go look at other boats and build a base for comparative purposes then circle back if you still think it's worth it, also don't limit your search to your local area.

peaman · Mar 26, 2024

I have a 1987 E32-3 for which I paid $30k three years ago. I am the third owner. It had a new Universal Diesel engine (110 hours), but otherwise was similar to what you describe, along with the Yachtworld images.

The damage on the bow in where the anchor locker drain exits the hull. If water is poured into the anchor locker, a visible stream should exit there. The rough finish looks like work was done to or at that drain exit.

The water in the forward locker under the V-berth is familiar to some of us. It is probably from leaks at deck level, around the anchor locker, or maybe the anchor locker drain wasn't properly fixed. There may be evidence of water damage at the bottom of the wood panel at the forward end of the berth. If not, the leak is likely elsewhere.

Leaks at hatches and portlights are common maintenance items for boats of this age. But availability of gaskets and other parts may become an issue, and the only recourse may be replacement of the entire unit. I know this, because I have the same portlights as on PPanther.

Binding of the bulkhead doors to the V-berth is of no concern, and can be fixed by careful use of a block plane.

The vinyl covered lifelines look likely to be original and should be replaced (bare 1x19 is favored). Likewise, the standing rigging is probably original, in which case, replacement is indicated, depending on how you plan to use the boat.

The stove appears to be original, and it may be fitted with a CNG (Compressed Natural Gas) supply. Your surveyor may even recognize it as such (mine didn't). Either way, if use of the stove is important, you should research that. That stove probably has no modern safety features, like closing the fuel valve on loss of flame, and it may not be connected to a leak detector.

I like that there are no obvious sloppy upgrades or "improvements", as seen in lots of other older boats. This one has been generally well kept.

Nothing in the listing or your description raises red flags, but in my opinion, the price needs to come down $5k-$10k, depending on the survey.

Christian Williams · Mar 26, 2024

A survey is expensive--what, $600+?--but it can be a bargain in tuition, even if the boat doesn't make the cut. Especially if you've never had a boat surveyed.

To be with a veteran surveyor through haul-out, bottom check, relaunch, engine start and brief test cruise is at least four hours of hands-on personal instruction. We should shadow the surveyor and grill with questions. It's how we get our money's worth. The document they produce is mainly boilerplate for insurance purposes, and some of it can be questionable. You can always dispute surveyor recommendations with the insurer, or at least agree to put them off.

Kenneth K · Mar 26, 2024

Ref pic # 2 and the cracks starboard of the anchor locker. I had a similar crack to starboard of my anchor locker hatch for years. I thought it was just cosmetic. Years later, I started seeing water stains below one of the stanchion posts above the galley. Turns out it was not that stanchion post that was leaking, but the anchor locker crack; water was running along a void in the laminated deck to finally exit below the stanchion base fasteners above the galley. See my posting here: https://ericsonyachts.org/ie/threads/anyone-whos-removed-your-anchor-pan.21034/
I still haven't repaired this crack. I only discovered it last fall and I'm waiting for warmer weather to do the epoxy and glass work.

This isn't an argument for or against your current purchase, it's just what happens with old boats. However, if you buy a boat that has many existing problems, you'll not only spend months fixing those issues, but you'll still need to address the new problems and leaks that pop up over time, in addition to routine maintenance and any improvements you might want to make. Notice we haven't even talked about sailing the boat yet.

Welcome to the dream... All of us here still accept these challenges. Just do your investigative work early so you have realistic expectations of your first couple of years with an old boat, and try not to overpay on the initial purchase. The owner really, really wants to sell this particular boat. You have hundreds of other alternative boats to choose from and an unlimited time over which to make your decision.

Prairie Schooner · Mar 26, 2024

Hi Bert,

In late summer 2021 we bought a single owner 1986 E35-3. The elderly owner had had health problems for some time and his family didn't keep the boat up as well as he did. Our boat came with many of the same issues you're looking at.

Our experience has been that we spent a lot of time with the boat on the hard while we got things fixed. I/we did most of the work ourselves. We only used her a half season in 2022. A full season 2023 but day sailing only because the sole was stripped out. This year (touch wood) we will be day sailing, cruising, and doing a little racing with our boat. If you're going to do most of the work yourself, you may have a similar experience. We both race weekly on other boats and have friends we go day sailing with so we were able to get plenty of time on the water.

Based on what I see in your assessment, PP looks like an average to fairly good example of an old boat. The comments already offered here are very good and $39K is too high. For reference, we paid $20K for our boat and have put more than $50K into it. But barring any major red flags in a survey, I think you'd end up with a pretty good vessel after some work and dough. I'm envious of the engine access and the 34 was high on our original shopping list because of the aft cabin. The sealing of the hull joint is a new-fangled novelty and my traditionalist nature is suspicious. I'd want my surveyor to look closely at that.

You may well have seen my thoughts on this site when another person was debating a purchase: - https://ericsonyachts.org/ie/threads/newbie-looking-at-e32-3-cutter-rig.21268/post-171667 post #11 It's kind of dour, but some cold water can be helpful. And the resale cost formula is at least illustrative, if not factual.

If you're okay with doing more boat work than sailing the first few years and are willing to put a good deal more money in, this might be a good choice for you. Again, I recommend trying to get on a regular-Joe racing team (not screaming Grand Prix nuts, just regular folks). I'm much more of a B-type cruiser by temperament but it got me on the water regularly, I learned a lot, and I found I loved racing. Or perhaps find someone elderly who doesn't want to give up their boat but needs someone to accompany them for regular outings. As we were shopping for a boat we met a guy with a beautiful Sweden 38 in just that situation. I felt bad we couldn't continue to sail with him.

Good luck!
Jeff

bertboyer · Mar 26, 2024

Thank you all for these helpful comments. Please keep them coming as I learn more every minute!!

Let me try to answer a few comments:

I agree it is overpriced, and I was planning to pay in cash for whatever boat we decide on. I'm debating next steps with this boat and your comments are great
I am looking elsewhere through Craigslist, Facebook Marketplace and Yachtworld and recently found another E34 (1990) in San Diego.
https://www.yachtworld.com/yacht/1990-ericson-34-9244926/
I am open to 30-38' Ericsons and I am fine waiting it out for the right boat.
A friend asked me to look at a Catalina 36...but I can't imagine anything but an Ericson and being part of this forum. I'll possibly consider it down the road...
My plan (goal) is coastal cruising in and around the San Juan and Gulf Islands with my partner who also loves sailing.
Re water in the forward V berth locker: There was significant crazing just aft of the locker on the starboard side. It was raised and dull sounding when tapped with the back of a screwdriver.
Re the stove, there was a propane tank in the aft cockpit locker, but there was also what appeared to be a CNG tank in the starboard locker. See this picture
I asked about the propane shutoff valve and we couldn't find it.
Lastly, regarding marine survey as an education: I never thought of this but I like the idea. I have several recommendations for a local marine surveyor (Alison Mazon) who I've heard is wonderful to for buyers to work with...but not the seller's dream surveyor!
IF I go forward to get this boat surveyed, I will definitely ask to be present.
And lastly, I have my name out to do some racing with people closer to my age (64). I was contacted by a couple folks with Merit 25s and went out with one Sunday. Hopefully this will continue and some cruisers will also reach out.

Thanks again. I can't tell you how much I appreciate everyones knowledge, time and suggestions!!

Christian Williams · Mar 26, 2024

On the asking price: Passion Yachts (the broker) seems real-world (not an aggregator). A middleman can be good to have.

I would make an appointment with the owner, or head person. I would explain my interest, and and cite (your) pretty extensive research.

I would ask them (yeah, I know, pronouns in 2024) to look up what Ericson 34s have sold for recently around the country (they have such info). I would express high interest in the boat, and a wish not to insult the owners, but the price seems a bit high relative to other similar listings.

"What would you, given your knowledge of the seller, think is the range of appropriate offers in this case? Would an offer of 30 thousand be inappropriate? Is a dialog possible?" You ask because although you're in no hurry, you are a cash buyer and this seems like a specimen you could write a check for right now, you really like the boat, subject to survey of course, and you would like to cross Pink Panther off the list if the owner evaluation is emotionally locked in stone because they don;t really wanna sell the boat anyhow at this ridiculous price." That end is perhaps not necessary.

The broker doesn't give a rat's pants whether it sells for 40 or 30 or 20. He takes 10 percent, probably with a minimum in writing .

People who need to sell listen according to how many offers they've had. Which the broker will tell you.

Loren Beach · Mar 26, 2024

bertboyer said:
Lastly, regarding marine survey as an education: I never thought of this but I like the idea. I have several recommendations for a local marine surveyor (Alison Mazon) who I've heard is wonderful to for buyers to work with...but not the seller's dream surveyor!

Alison is not the only qualified surveyor in the area, but she is the best. (!)
And yup, one or two local brokers dislike her because she informs the buyer of all the good and the bad about a boat.

I am paraphrasing some to recall the conversation, but we were talking one day about the "role" of a surveyor. She observed that the seller just wants a sale completed close enough to their asking price. The broker wants a done deal so they can get a commission. The buyer is sometimes unknowledgeable about boats and systems and often enamored of the boat and sometimes blinded to its flaws in their eagerness to buy it.

The ONLY person who actually "speaks for the boat" is the marine surveyor. It is a very detailed task to perform. Sometimes the seller would like to muzzle the boat and not have it tell about neglect and indifference....

Personally, I have had this boat and our previous 26 footer surveyed (over the years and once at an insurer's request) by four different surveyors. All were very attentive to details and produced a well-documented survey.

A purchase survey, IMHO, serves as a guideline for your first several years of ownership, laying out items to be rectified immediately (hopefully very few), items to be done within a year or two, and longer term stuff that will need upgrades or repair.

Opinion: While there are certainly some good brands other than Ericson, when you buy a strong and well-designed craft, you start with "good bones" going forward. To me it makes little sense to pour money into a cheap-built boat that never was constructed very well when it was new.

bertboyer · Mar 27, 2024

The Passion Yachts broker I met (Mike) was also the owner of Passion Yachts. When my partner asked Mike why the boat didn't sell in the past two years, he seemed honest and told her that the owners priced it way to high in the first listing. I don't have a problem asking Mike whether a $30K cash offer would be considered or if they would just be insulted.

For now, I am taking in all the responses on EY.o, talking to sailing friends, and am thinking very hard about asking for the marine survey, but then I also see other boats that have had so many upgrades already done, that I get cold feet on this boat.

For example, I saw this one on EY.o earlier today: https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/boa/d/port-costa-1983-ericson-35/7727575526.html
So many upgrades. Just like the 1990 E34 in San Diego. Many upgrades. It feels to me like Pink Panther's owner took good care of the boat and ignored upgrading anything.

So I am currently processing and trying to decide whether to wait longer for something better, or see if I can get this boat at a much more reasonable price...pending no huge surprises or structural damage from a survey. For me, a survey and sea trial with an experienced captain (and friend) is a requirement.

peaman · Mar 27, 2024

In the three years I have had my E32-3, I have done a lot of the projects listed for "True Norse", so below I show approximate costs, as best I remember for them, all DIY except for standing rigging and hatch lens replacement. You probably need to plan on a trip to Benicia.

$6,000. The boat had all new standing rigging in 2020.
$1,400. 3-burner "Force 10" gimballed stove.
$700. All new Plexiglass in portlights and top hatches
$1500 (?) New stainless steel Navionics tower installed with NavPod System
$1500 Lewmar teak folding cockpit table

$10,000 or so:
B&G Vulcan 9” chart plotter with mast head Bluetooth Wind Package with “Sail steer” installed.
New B&G Triton integrated bulkhead display with depth, true and apparent wind & tide directions.
New through-hull B&G (Navico)710 transducer with new paddle wheel.
New B&G 3G Radar Dish installed and integrated to the B&G Vulcan Chart plotter with i-pad repeater
New Raymarine P90 Wheel pilot with ACU 100 control unit installed
New wire harness and switches separating Radar, Autopilot and Chart plotter.

Rodney · Mar 27, 2024

I would add this one to your list. I believe that price is Canadian $

Ericson 35-3 - boats - by owner - craigslist

Ericson 35-3. Set up well for single or double handed cruising and club racing. Full baton main, 110 jib and A-kite. Under 300 hrs on the diesel. Full cockpit canvas. New hot water tank, autopilot,...

vancouver.craigslist.org

andy beach · Mar 27, 2024

I was lucky and was able to charter not one but two Ericson 34's before purchasing my own. They were both in the shoulder season in the San Juan Islands. When I returned one of them at the end of a week long charter, the company made me refill the diesel. I think we put in 3 gallons much to their amazement. I was hooked. I also chartered other boats mostly Catalina's. Chartering may be a good way to find the boat and systems that work best for your sailing family. When boat shopping I looked at a lot of boats before I considered having surveys done on any of them. Anyways...my two cents. Good luck with your boat shopping.

Chalumeau · Mar 27, 2024

bertboyer said:
E34 Pink Panther visit - What I learned (with Pictures)

I visited this boat yesterday and for new readers you will see a previous thread where I discussed this boat with EY.o Forum members.

Here is the Yachtworld listing:

1988 Ericson 34 Racer/Cruiser for sale - YachtWorld

Find more information and images about the boat and contact the seller or search more boats for sale on YachtWorld.

www.yachtworld.com

Also note that another member posted about this boat a year ago and that thread can be found by searching for "Pink Panther"

Thanks for your comments and my apologies for not correctly attaching the photos on the first posting.

Bert

This is a single owner boat with no maintenance invoices. It was in a slip, so I know it floats I really liked the lines and the saloon and berths. I also like what I read in sailboat data. However, there are some issues I’d like to share, and get your opinions on...

The broker said the boat was only sailed in the Columbia River and maybe once to the Puget Sound. He thought he could get the engine hours. He said the boat was on the market for a long time (>2 years) as the owners were initially asking too much ($47K). According to the broker, the boat has not had a marine survey done on it. He said the hull needs painting as it was last painted about 3 years ago, and it has blisters.

The bow of the boat looked like it bumped the dock (see photo). I couldn’t inspect the keel, but the broker said it was in good shape (a marine survey and haul out will answer the question). Not sure if these things are related, but the bulkhead doors to the V berth don’t close. There is about a ¼ inch overlap (see pic). I couldn’t get to the bulkhead tabbing to inspect.
View attachment 49506
The main and jib sails are circa 1999. They were not raised for me in this visit, but appeared to be ok without fraying – I’m not a sail expert, so I could be way off on this one. The spinnaker sail is only 2-3 years old and rarely used.

The deck does have some crazing/gelcoat cracks, but they mostly appear in very small groupings. However, one area just aft of the anchor locker on the starboard side is slightly raised and sounds dull when tapped with the back of a screwdriver (see pic).
View attachment 49507
There is no windlass – a must (for us) for coastal cruising in the PNW.

There was no visible caulk around the toe rail or hatches. The bulwarks/deck joint looks fine to me and seems custom as others pointed out. All hatches and portlights open, the gaskets are supple and the plexiglass appears nice and clean (no crazing). Several portlights were replaced, and several of the rubber gaskets stuck to the plexiglass when opened. The V berth hatch was leaking above the bulkhead (see pic).

View attachment 49508
The stanchions appear sturdy, but most of the lifeline end fittings show rust (see picture). The mast seems straight with no visible dimples or ridges. The shrouds were a bit loose, but didn’t seem to move the spreaders. The chainplates seemed in good shape without caulking, rust or cracks in the gelcoat. No extra caulking around hatches, portlights or standing rigging plates. The running rigging seems a little frayed and old to me (see pic)

View attachment 49509 View attachment 49510

The helm steering wheel turns nicely and doesn’t seem to have any play in it. The Richie compass looks great, but all the electronics are old…as mentioned earlier. The winches seem in good shape (from listening to them when turned slowly). All canvas covers seem pretty nice and mostly stiff….but there was also light rain during our visit so everything was wet. Although there was some mold/moss on the cover above the companionway, it’s Portland where everything turns green in winter!

Down Below:

The interior wood and cabinetry looked very nice overall, clean counters, and nice upholstery. The ice boxes had little refrigeration/freezer pads added. The oven and stovetop hardly looked used. The bilges all had about an inch or two of water in them. The engine was very accessible, appeared clean to me with no oil drips, belt dust, or water (see pics). The batteries (2) were clean and without corrosion. The broker said we could do a cold start on the next visit. but there were a few issues I’d like to point out:
View attachment 49511 View attachment 49512

The V berth wood was moist under the cushions, so I inspected more...

The forward-most locker/storage area under the furthest forward V Berth cushion had water in it (see picture). I didn’t see water in the anchor locker above it, but I also didn’t take out the anchors, chain, and rode to look further as it was raining.

View attachment 49513

The sole just aft of the bulkhead had water stains (see pictures). The broker said it was from a leaky hatch that has been replaced.

View attachment 49514 View attachment 49515

The bulkhead doors to the V berth not aligned as mentioned earlier.

The head looked pretty clean (no smell), but there was a pink fluid near the base of the toilet and to the left of it (see picture).

The keel bolts were corrosion free, but in about an inch of water. There was one bilge pump and one manual pump.

----------------------------------------------------

Overall, our first feeling/assessment.

We liked the lines of the E34 a lot. The saloon was extremely well kept, comfortable and well designed. We could definitely enjoy sailing in the PNW with an E34…BUT, it seems like there are quite a few major maintenance issues addressed earlier, and I don’t even have a marine survey yet. Are the level of these concerns typical of a 36 year old boat? Should I keep looking for something better or proceed with a marine survey?

I’d really appreciate your thoughts.

All the best,
Bert

Bert,
The thing that jumps out to me is the heat exchanger on the Universal auxiliary engine. Not a very difficult repair, but that part is pricey. It may be something to be used for a little more leverage to lower the price. Since seeing this area around the filler cap, I would also be suspect of the water lift components before the muffler. Might as well check them and do them at the same time.

I would definitely survey this vessel prior to proceeding with any offers.

good luck!

Elizabeth

Pete the Cat · Mar 27, 2024

Here are some random observations based on your observations:
1. The leaks you are noticing are not real deal breakers to me. If you own a boat for any length of time you will have leaks and most on an Ericson are easily resolved because the hull to deck seam is not the problem it can be on other production boats. I would assume the damage they have caused might be permanent for the wood--the floors are difficult to repair. You will need to check the bedding of the windows, hatches and virtually every stanchion at some point to stop them, but you will. Its a process and it will be repeated if you own the boat long enough.
2. You are correct to be looking at structure, because that could be expensive and need a special visit to the boatyard for professional help. I would be concerned about the doors not closing; Ericson's TAFG really secures the structure of the boat and those doors fit when the boat came out of the factory--something has happened. A good surveyor will be able to give you an idea of the severity of this problem-- a lousy one will just list it (OK I will avoid my usual rant about poor quality surveyors).
3. I would not worry about blisters or cracks in the gelcoat if you can accept the esthetics. Both were apparently common in some of the later Ericsons. My boat has both and I have ignored them. They are most likely from careless mixing of the catalysts in the gelcoat--it is an art and science to mix this stuff because it is dependent on the ambient temperature even if you follow the directions. Gelcoat is not structural.
4. On the negotiation process. You might be getting to the point where you can compare some boats and understand what you would consider a good deal. Here is my process: Is the engine and structure I see acceptable---if so, then I figure what I am willing to offer for the boat just as it is. Then I add to that number what I need to add right away (sails, cushions, electronics) to make it sailable for the next year or two. There will always be surprises in boat ownership, but that would be the number that I shop and compare options with (using the same math). I generally do not like to get into extended negotiations, and --in my most recent case-- my final number was 40% less than the asking price. I told the broker that I did not want to insult the owner, but that I had done the math and this was my first and last offer--I made it clear I was not opening a negotiation or giving a purposely low ball offer--this is what the boat was worth to me. I would be willing to pay a premium for a well-maintained boat, but this was not such an example. It has worked for me on two yacht purchases.
Again, just a FWIW. And just a perspective on the process.

Loren Beach · Mar 27, 2024

Chalumeau said:
I would definitely survey this vessel prior to proceeding with any offers.

While that might be normal in some locales, in my area a survey is paid for by the person making the offer on the boat after the offer is accepted ("pending the survey") and after some earnest money is turned over to the broker who holds that check. Note that the would be buyer owns the resulting survey, and the seller or broker (or anyone else) can only view it with permission.
Back when we were shopping, I made an offer - accompanied by a 10% check - on another boat (an Ericson I should note) and when the seller would not even negotiate or counter on my cash offer, the broker tore up my check, and we continued looking. We shortly found the boat we now own. It was a fixer upper, and there was some discussion with the broker and with the seller. In the end we believe that the broker tactfully explained to the seller that our offer was quite fair given the boat's condition.
And... our adventure began!

Hard to believe that was 3 decades ago.

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