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Liveaboard: 35's vs. 38's

deadpoet

Junior Member
I'm considering buying an Ericson 35 or 38 as a liveaboard, and I wondered if anyone who's owned or been in both boats for a few overnighters could help me. I know that bigger is always better if you're going to spend much of your time at the dock, but it seems to me that the 35 (Mark III--the one with the separate shower, unless later Mark II's had them as well) is a better deal. It LOOKS like the three feet that got pulled out of the 38 to make the Mark III 35 came only out of the galley and navigation table section towards the rear (sorry--aft) of the boat, where, on the 38, you have that little booth-sized area you can close off for privacy in front of the rear quarter berth. Although it's possible that they stole six inches here and three there, etc. I can't tell from the photos.

Anyway, my question is this. If you've spent time--especially lived on--a 35 (Mark III--I've gotta have that separate shower) AND a 38 (the later models--again, with a separate shower and what I think they call the tri-cabin layout), would you recommend going with the 35 as a liveaboard for the slightly cheaper purchase price (or equal purchase price but newer boat) and slightly cheaper most about everything, etc., or do you think that, for a liveaboard, I'd REALLY miss that extra 3 feet, especially if I had guests for a few days or my two daughters (pre-teen) came to visit for a couple of weeks?

I really would appreciate any thoughts on this. Feel free to ramble on about the hows and whys of the differences; I'm an English teacher, so I'm used to that.

As you can see from the above.

Thanks.
 

Frank Langer

1984 Ericson 30+, Nanaimo, BC
It might be helpful to know a bit more about how you plan to use the boat, aside from living aboard--ie. will you be cruising or mainly using it as a condo at the dock? If cruising, in what waters? If cruising, will you be single-handing or will you have crew? Will it be only you living aboard, aside from occasional visits from daughters, or will there be others living aboard on a regular basis (eg. a partner).
Also, from a manageability point of view, will this be your first boat/new sailor, or are you fairly knowledgeable about boats and able to manage a 38 footer?
Just some questions that others may have as well, as they try to give you a helpful reply.
Frank.
 

Mike.Gritten

Member III
My wife and I liveaboard our 1975 E35 MkII and I feel qualified to offer my 2 cents worth here. First, you're right on with the shower thing. We do shower on board but my wife describes the process (i.e. you stand in the "well" in the head and pull a shower curtain all around you - it's quite tight) as showering in a condom! Not for the claustrophobic. As for which boat would make a better livaboard - we'd opt for the larger of the two choices every time. No matter what else you like or dislike about one or the other, you will ALWAYS appreciate the additional volume, no matter how small the difference might seem initially. Yes, it does cost significantly more for everything else - anchors, rode, lines, sails, winches, blocks, etc. - but you will adjust accordingly while appreciating the larger living space.
 

Chris Miller

Sustaining Member
The 38 gets you a second private cabin... that was key in our purchase. agreed that the separate shower is a must. Otherwise, it's all in what you can live with.
Chris
 

treilley

Sustaining Partner
The 38 would probably be better but with a few strategically placed curtains around the quarter berth, the 35 would also work. I have spent as much as 2 weeks aboard and felt as comfortable the day I got back as the day I left. Some people only shower on shore. We go places where there are no showers and the built in shower is very nice to have.

I might consider basing my decision on condition and price given that you would probably be fine on either model.

As far as what type of sailing, they are pretty much the same boat. The 38 being a little bigger. Basically the same rig and deck setup. If you get a chance to sail on either one, that will tell you how they both sail and motor.

Another consideration is slip size. A 35ft. slip may be less than a 38ft. slip.
 

jkm

Member III
Any boat with a double berth rather than the quarter berth would work for me.

But I still can't understand how any boat, at the age of ours, could possibly not develop problems with water in the bilge continuously. If you want to live aboard, which is very common here at Marina Del Rey why not use the shore facilities?

No one uses their on board shower because of the problem with grey water. Dumping it ito the harbor will draw a huge fine and the ire of adjoining boat owners.

A Catalina 42 would be a perfect liveaboard.

John
 

Chris Miller

Sustaining Member
But I still can't understand how any boat, at the age of ours, could possibly not develop problems with water in the bilge continuously. If you want to live aboard, which is very common here at Marina Del Rey why not use the shore facilities?

John

The later 38's have a separate shower sump that keeps shower water out of the bilge. Do the authorities really complain about soap in CA?? How do boat owners do dishes?
Chris
 

gareth harris

Sustaining Member
I lived, alone, on my E35 for a number of years. I saw no need to worry about installing a shower since there was one at the clubhouse.
And I loved living on the boat.

For three of you, I think the boat would seem confining, expecially in a few years time as they become teenagers. Some people are happy like that, others not; the E38 would feel more spacious both for personal space, and for storage space.

As others have said, everything goes up in price for a larger boat, so you have to budget significantly more in operating costs in addition to initial purchase.

Gareth
Freyja E35 #241 1972
 

rwthomas1

Sustaining Partner
One of the reasons we bought the E38 was with the possibility that it might have to serve as a home. Having spent a week at a time on it, there is plenty of room for two people. We have the open quarterberth layout, no second cabin. Fine with us, we have only had overnight guests once. Its a great couples boat.

Regarding the separate hower, we use it all the time. Nothing better than a hot shower in a reasonable space after sailing all day. Kalifornia is quite ridiculous if soapy shower water is now verboten. Silly considering the runoff from roadways when it rains..... Papers please, have your papers ready for the authorities! Heres your armband, now get in line. Achtung! Geez, so glad I live here. RT
 

Alex

Junior Member
My wife and I lived on our E38 for about seven months (we moved aboard shortly after buying her 10 months ago). Mostly dockside, but sailed the boat regulary. I very often singlehand her and don't see how it could be a lot easier to single hand a 35 mkiii (as mentioned earlier they are very similar layout on deck). Our 38 is the older version with the quarter berth and nav-table to starboard that can be closed off with the shutters. Don't think we have ever closed that area up, but the large-ish nav area makes a great second area to study/work etc.. We shower at the dock, but use the shower stall to hang wet cloths/towels and for a dirty laundry area. Another nice feature of the older 38 is the small table to port across from the dinette, someone can eat/work there while someon else has the big table in use. We seriously considered a 35 mkiii (better shape and newer for the same price), but went for more room. I think in that regard we made the right choice. we have not had overnight guests, but there is room for it. The 38 is a great sailing boat and is a lot of fun/easy to handle with a small crew.

-Alex
 

deadpoet

Junior Member
Liveaboard: 35 vs. 38

It might be helpful to know a bit more about how you plan to use the boat, aside from living aboard--ie. will you be cruising or mainly using it as a condo at the dock? If cruising, in what waters? If cruising, will you be single-handing or will you have crew? Will it be only you living aboard, aside from occasional visits from daughters, or will there be others living aboard on a regular basis (eg. a partner).
Also, from a manageability point of view, will this be your first boat/new sailor, or are you fairly knowledgeable about boats and able to manage a 38 footer?
Just some questions that others may have as well, as they try to give you a helpful reply.
Frank.

Hey, Frank. Thanks for the suggestion. Embarrassing as it is to admit it, I'd say that mainly I'd be moored at the dock at first. If I do this, I'll do it in Portland, OR, and, being from Florida and most familiar with the Atlantic Coast/St. John's River/Intercoastal Waterway, what I've heard about the Northwest waters spooks me a little. After some more time and experience, I could see doing a trip up to Seattle and B.C., as I understand there's a pretty protected passage up that way. But most of my training time would be on the Columbia River.

I've got my keelboat certification and a bit of small sailboat experience, but no, I'm not experienced. I'm a neophyte. Now, I've grown up boating, and have spent weekends and such on my granddad's cabin cruiser or trawler on the St. John's River, so managing a 35- or 38-foot boat doesn't intimidate me--under power. Under sail is a different matter. It's another reason I'm leaning toward the 35, although some say there's little difference.

If I cruise, I'll have some crew, though they'll probably be sort of green, too.

I'll probably be mostly living alone on the boat, at least for now. But my brother lives in Portland, and he's got a steady girlfriend, and I've been seeing a woman in an on-again, off-again sort of way, so there might be a few weekends where we'd have four adults on board.

I hope I've posted this properly. Again, thanks for your suggestions.

John
 

Frank Langer

1984 Ericson 30+, Nanaimo, BC
John, others have responded with some comments that have probably answered your questions.

My own experience is that my wife and I have lived aboard our Ericson 30+ (ie. 30 footer) for up to 2 weeks quite comfortably, and have had our adult kids and their partners visit for up to 4 days at a time (have had 5 adults living on the boat during those visits). While that was a bit crowded, we all get along well and managed fine, with everyone recognizing that we would have to live a bit "closer" than we would otherwise.

Our plan is to retire in one year and then take trips of up to 2 weeks at a time, sometimes with another couple on board, and I think the Ericson 30+ is fine for that.

From what you describe, although more space on a boat is always a good thing, it comes at a greater cost for equipment replacement, moorage and time for maintenance. If I had to choose, I would choose the E35 rather than the E38, based on my understanding of your situation. I might even take a look at an E32, given that it will often be just you, or you and your sometimes partner on board. If your brother and his partner joined you, making 4 adults, the E32 is still pretty comfortable for that.

Finally, as you become comfortable with whatever boat you buy, keep the British Columbia Gulf Islands in mind as a future destination--they are quite protected, are beautiful beyond belief with lots of marinas, anchorages, etc.

Good luck with your decision.

Frank.
 

noproblemo2

Member III
Having been a "live-aboard" for many years on our E-38, Personally, the only way in my opinion to go compiled with cruising and living a board. The living space is VERY comfortable and can be customized to your needs and grow with your needs just as a home on land would do, you just "require" less in a boating life style. One can and does adjust to their environment, and boating is a very nice lifestyle for singles as well as families.:egrin:
 

ChrisS

Member III
Grey water

A few people have mentioned grey water regulations in California. Are these state or local laws?

I don't know many small boats on my dock that don't have sinks that drain into the Bay, and when we overnight we use solar showers on deck. I see many people washing the exteriors of their boats, suds going into the Bay.

We don't use antibacterial soaps at home or on the boat as we've read that those compounds can't be taken out by sewage systems.

Are people really getting tickets?
 

MarkA

Please Contact Admin.
Kalifornia is quite ridiculous if soapy shower water is now verboten. Silly considering the runoff from roadways when it rains..... Papers please, have your papers ready for the authorities! Heres your armband, now get in line. Achtung! Geez, so glad I live here. RT

When it does what???

They do try to keep the harbors clean, and many are pristine enough to snorkle in, with dozens of feet of underwater visibility. It's nice to be able to eat the fish and lobster we catch while moored in some of the harbors.

No, I'm NOT talking about LA Harbor.
 

jkm

Member III
Neither am I. LA Harbor could melt a boat.

There are local county health regulations that prohibit any grey water from going into Marina Del Rey. They are not enforced, yet a golfing buddy who runs one of the district offices says they are discussing an educational program with possible enforcement.

I once was a few slips from a fellow who not only cooked lots of bacon every morning, but did his laundry on board. The scum that was at our water line every day was disheartening. Fortunately his boat sunk.

It seems that not only have the CG and Sheriff been more visible, the dockmasters have also tried to keep an eye on things. It seems that the Marina is changing from the scows to recreational boaters who tend to follow rules a little better.

In the twenty years I've been in the Marina it has steadily gotten better to the point that we have abundant marine life and visibility has improved to a few yards.

Without hesitation I will say that I been made aware, though diving, the escalation in the destruction of the sea. Coral that I have dived is dead a few years later and it is very very dead. Unfortunately I have not always been the best steward of the sea.

Hope it gets turned around

John
 

chaco

Member III
LiveAboard ?

Just a Little reminder. DO NOT assume that when you Shop for a Slip that
you can LiveAboard :confused:
Most Harbors on the West Coast have Percentage Limits on LiveAboards.
Here in Oceanside the Harbor allows 10% of the Slips to have LiveAboard
Permits. You must get on a list and wait for an Opening (2-3 YEARS :mad:)
Then...you have to MOVE to the Slip that is available.
We have a max 72 Hour per week Stay. I looked in to LiveAboard in Morrow
Bay and was told the Harbor had reached it's Limit...even on Moorings !
Get ALL the Rules IN WRITING before you make a Decision.

The E35II is quite comfortable....but I would pick the E38 ANY DAY :nerd:

Good Luck :egrin: :egrin: /) /)
 
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