Is emergency rudder post effective?

My 1984 E30+ came with an emergency rudder post in the event that the steering wheel or mechanism fails. In reading about offshore sailing, several books talk about how difficult it is to operate jury-rigged rudders/tillers/etc. due to the forces on the rudder. They also say that the normal wheel mechanism on a 40 foot boat is similar to steering with a 15 foot tiller.
My question: has anyone used the emergency rudder post on an Ericson 30+, or on any Ericson, and does it actually work as one might imagine? Any tips to improve the way it handles?
I know I should take the boat out and try it some day, and I will do that, but til then, anyone know anything about this?
Thanks,
Frank.

The standard emergency tiller for the E/30+ is way too short to be usable in moderate to heavy weather, and I'll bet it's an enormous pain even in light conditions. Its size is limited due to the placement of the steering pedestal, of course. The typical workaround for this issue that I've heard is to rig steering lines from the tiller to blocks on the rail, and then to the winches.

I think a better plan is to keep onboard a couple lengths of thin high-tech line that can be used to replace the steering cables in a pinch. On an extended cruise, it would be prudent to keep a spare set of cables.

Emergency tiller?

Is the item that you have an emergency tiller?

I used mine of a crossing from NZ to Tonga on an E-39 it did a fine job, Some of the e-39's even came as tiller only boats.

A 40 footer can be steered fine with a tiller that is a lot less than 15 feet.

Guy

Thanks for your replies. My boat came with an aluminum post that apparently fits over the rudder post (through a port in the cockpit floor), and then has a smaller aluminum bar that fits through a hole in the top of the post, to serve as a tiller. I'm not sure how the "tiller" will clear the steering wheel, but there must be a way. It all looks a bit "makeshift", but may be ok in an emergency. I don't have access to the boat at the moment, but will try it next time I'm out; however, it would still be nice if someone has used this mechanism and can comment on its effectiveness, before I find myself adrift on the ocean.
Thx.
Frank.

Ah that is different completely....

The issues of the makeshift emergency tiller abound. The issues are that generally they have to fit between the wheel and the cockpit coaming. This is a really small space. Most of them must use a set of blocks and line on each side to generate enough force to actually steer the boat. You should design a system for your boat, and have the hardware necessary on hand.

The other solution is to bring the tiller above the wheel, or make the wheel easily removable (Does nothing if you have a large pedestal guard though).

It does sound however like you need some more mechanical advantage.

Guy

Thanks, Guy. Good advice, as usual.
Frank.

On our last boat the rudder post access was about a foot aft of the binnacle, so the emergency tiller faced aft when fitted over the rudder post. It was about 4 feet long (38 foot boat), and I actually never gave it a try, but I imagine it would be doable but difficult. Tillers I've seen on boats that size are about 6 feet.

Guy Stevens said:

I used mine of a crossing from NZ to Tonga on an E-39 it did a fine job, Some of the e-39's even came as tiller only boats.

Click to expand...

My boat is tiller only. Do you think a wheel would be a good addition, bearing in mind I am preparing my boat for the Atlantic? I am replacing the rudder and cockpit deck anyway (hurricane damage), so adding a wheel would fit into the job fairly well.

Gareth
Freyja E35 #241 1972

I don't really know the answer to your question, but some thoughts: there are boats in your size that have tillers, so it's not a given that an oceangoing boat have a wheel; a tiller/rudder attachment is likely more trouble-free and easier to repair underway than a wheel/cable arrangement; a tiller may be easier to lash in place than a wheel if you need a break from steering; a tiller is likely easier/cheaper to replace if necessary; it's easier to steer a boat from the "high side" with a tiller than with a wheel.

In short, while I like the wheel on my boat, I would not make the change you are considering unless someone else can give you a good reason for doing so, or you just really want wheel steering.

Just my thoughts....

Frank.

That much leverage shouldn't be needed

My boat is tiller-only.

The first couple times I sailed it in 15-20 kt winds, I had to put all my body weight into fighting weather helm, and it sometimes felt like the tiller would snap.

Then I discovered the traveller.

[And the main halyard. And the outhaul. And the boom vang. And the backstay. And the reefing lines.]

Now I can let go in most weather conditions, points of sail, and heeling angles, and the boat tracks perfectly straight. Course changes can be made with only a couple fingers on the tiller, and often only a foot or so away from the rudder post.

After all, tiller pilots mount only 12-18 inches from the rudder post.

Therefore, I would say trim and balance is usually more important than tiller length.

Uh, yeah

Great points about NOT using a longer tiller to solve a weather helm problem-the trouble lies elsewhere.

All I can add here is: Frank, as you probably have figured out, you don't really have an emergency POST. The POST, to which the steering quadrant attaches is the only post on the boat. You DO have an emergency tiller as you have described-I think that for the E boats of that period, the concept was to remove the wheel from the pedestal when using the E-tiller.

Gareth-The 35 is so much happier weight-wise with a tiller-it keeps weight out of the back end. If your plans for the Atlantic include self-steering, you will be using it 99% of the time you are sailing, so the tiller should be a non-issue. In fact, if you plan on a windvane type, add the pounds of the vane and a wheel aft and you will be doing wheelies all over the ocean!!!

Not reallly, but from what you say, stick with the tiller for less maintenance, cost, and better performance. A wheel would be arguably better if you planned long stretches of hand steerng (key word: arguably), but with the Vane or Otto Von Helm doing the work, who cares?

For ocean sailing on the 35-2, another good argument for the tiller, even if you DO plan on doing a lot of driving by hand, is that with a tiller you can get under a dodger while driiving and stay out of the elements. With a wheel, you are out in the cold, while your crew sits huddled fwd under the dodger and laughs at you

That's my shot from the Peanut gallery,
S

I used to get annoyed with the way the wheel nut always seemed to loosen while sailing...or powering, for that matter; then someone told me that the nut was meant to be non-tightenable for the expressed purpose of allowing the wheel to be removed quickly by hand when one had to ship the tiller. It's amazing what a difference removing the flywheel makes when tillering.
howard keiper
SeaQuest
Berkeley

Howard, I can appreciate that the nut may need to be somewhat easily removeable in case of an emergency, but I have also been concerned about how quickly that steering wheel nut loosens while underway--I'm hand-tightening mine about every half hour! I have considered putting some kind of friction material--eg. locktite? --on it, to hold it in place, but so it can be removed if needed with mild force. Any ideas along those lines?

I am concerned that if my wife forgets to hand tighten it periodically while at the helm, it will fall off, roll down the scupper drain, the wheel will lift off in her hands, and then we'll have a real emergency!! :0305_alar

Frank.

Try green loctite. This is the lowest strength formula. You will need a wrench to overcome the bond but it won't take much. RT

What I have done (successfully) is to put a large ruber washer over the threaded post and tighten the nut against that. It functiones like a big benign lock washer.
howard

Great suggestions--thanks!
Frank.

I had not thought of most of those points, thanks to all. I spoke to a salesman from Edson, who told me it would cost in the region of $2800 for parts, so I think that money would probably be much better invested in an autopilot.

Gareth
Freyja E35 #241 1972

My wheel nut used to loosen all the time as well. An easy fix is to just take the nut off, wrap some white teflon tape around a few times & tighten the nut over it. Hasn't come off since, but I know it will never seize on me & I can get it off anytime.

Steve Gabbott
E35/3 Silent Dancer
Vancouver