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E38 rudder post grease fittings?

rwthomas1

Sustaining Partner
Hey, this may be a dumb question but where are the grease fittings on the rudder post of a '83 E38? I have looked and can't seem to find them.... Not the most accessible area as you can imagine. Thanks, RT
 

footrope

Contributing Partner
Blogs Author
Hey Rob,

Just as a data point, I looked for one a few weeks ago and I didn't find one on my rudder post. I am trying to decide what to do about it. Looks like I would need to drop the rudder to grease or to add a grease fitting. Thinking about a few other jobs under there while I'm on the beach.
 

Steve

Member III
For what it's worth!

:) My 84 35-3 is likely the same rudder set-up as the pre-200 series 38's. My only fitting was facing forward at the very bottom of the rudder log/tube. None at the top, and of course behind the water heater. You could just "feel" it from the aft locker reaching in, after removing the bulk head that protects the steering quadrant, try a mirror. When I changed out the HWH I was able to get a good look and modify. If it hasn't been used in some time you may find some rusty outcropping that doesn't resemble a Zerk any more. This will require drilling out and re tapping the hole if you can't get it out conventionally. I believe this area is a few inch's below water line. We ended up adding a rubber extension grease hose to make regular greasing easy from the aft locker.
 

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ted_reshetiloff

Contributing Partner
My 38 is a 1989 200 series boat and it has 2 fittings. One is located where the arrow in Steves diagram for Rudder Post points to, facing aft. There is another up where the post goes through the deck for the emergency tiller. I needed to shim my rudder post when I first got my boat. I dropped the rudder by myself, using an automotive type jack stand for help. I used 6" wide .005" thick bronze shim stock from Mcmaster Carr. When I reinstalled I liberally applied grease by hand. I have since discovered that the lower zirc is seized and have not gotten to replacement. It is on the list with new engine cables... I guess my point here is if you are on the hard its not that tough to handle dropping the rudded and greasing by hand. This rudder tube is most likely underwater any time the boat is sailed or motored near hull speed and adding more holes may not be the most favored solution anyway. I am not so sure squeezing grease into the rudder tube will ensure it gets to the bearings anyway... Probably a good time to repack the stuffing box on the rudder tube too...
 

rwthomas1

Sustaining Partner
Thanks All!
Depending on point of sail the rudder/steering is making a groaning noise. Sometimes when turning the wheel, sometimes from wave action so I was looking to grease it if possible. The boat is going to be stored in-water for the winter so if the zerk is there but crusty it will have to wait. Doing a quick haul next June to paint the bottom and the rudder greasing will have to wait until then. Thanks, RT
 

Loren Beach

O34 - Portland, OR
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
And while you are spending some quality time relaxing under the cockpit... be sure to check the two sheaves for wear at their bearings on their axles. These are the ones that turn the cables 90 degrees, under the pedistal.
That's where I found and fixed a problem earlier this summer on our '88 model. My photos are part of this recent thread:
http://www.ericsonyachts.org/infoexchange/showthread.php?t=3473&referrerid=28

Best,

Loren
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
E38 Rudder Tube Grease Fitting?

There's a bronze plug in a half-inch fitting where the tube meets the hull.

I figure it's a grease fitting, but what kind? Does a big Zerk nipple go in it?

Why the plug and not a Zerk?

Could a grease gun connect direct, perhaps?

I showed the plug to a fancy boat yard and they had no ideas whatever, and claimed it probably wasn't for grease.
 

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ignacio

Member III
Blogs Author
Naturally, that's for bilge irrigation.

There's a bronze plug in a half-inch fitting where the tube meets the hull.

I figure it's a grease fitting, but what kind? Does a big Zerk nipple go in it?

Why the plug and not a Zerk?

Could a grease gun connect direct, perhaps?

I showed the plug to a fancy boat yard and they had no ideas whatever, and claimed it probably wasn't for grease.
 

ignacio

Member III
Blogs Author
Maybe install a 1/2" male x 1/4" female reducing bushing (McMaster #4429K422: http://www.mcmaster.com/#4429k422/=148v5z6), and then install a 1/4" zerk into the reducing bushing? The plug approach seems longer-lived than a glassed-in zerk. f it's clogged with petrified grease, maybe the 1/2" opening offers some space to clear it out with a coat hanger or paper clip.
 
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Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
A quick trip to an automotive store provided the Zerk. I think the previous owner left the plug in the bronze fitting because the auto Zerks are plated. Good idea.

I pumped in as much grease as I could, about 3 ounces. Wheel seems happier.

Just for the record, the grease gun fitting ( the coupler) needs to be tightened over the nipple to withstand any real pumping pressure. When finished, loosen it so the gun will come off the Zerk.

Never knew that before.

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Kevin A Wright

Member III
Well I wish I would have looked at this thread sooner.

Just spent 2 hours trying to pump grease into my 1986 E35 Mk3. After emptying the stbd lazarette I managed to squeeze my 6' 260# hulk down into the hold. I can do this but of course cant quite bend my head down enough to see well or get my shoulders down far enough to reach anything directly. Got a bunch of wood blocks to hold the various drain hoses out of the way so I could get the grease gun on the fitting. No go - plugged solid. But ahah! I had though ahead to bring my socket set with extensions for just this eventuality. Neptune and Murphy must have been off playing poker somewhere because the zirk came right out, but then immeadiately dropped behind the tangle of hoses in the bilge where I could not see it.

Oh, well. Sqeezed back out of the hole and made a run to the hardware store. Bought a package of the largest zirks they had (I/8" NPT) and one of those little magnetic grabby things as well. Squeeze back in and managed to retrieve the old fitting. Damn, it's 1/4" NPT. So squeeze back out and make a run to the auto parts store where got the right size (and another run back to the hardware store to return the others).

Back down into the hole I go. I've prewrapped the new zirk with Teflon tape and go to insert it into the socket so I can snake it back into position. It's a different size than the old one. Something that isn't in the set I have with me. While I'm at it I take a poke at the exposed grease in the end of the rudder post bushing with a piece of threaded rod. Hard as epoxy.

So back out of the hole and back to work. Tonight I'll find the right socket for the new fittings and dig out my extended drill bits so I can ream out the old hardened stuff. Maybe tomorrow I will finally be able to get some grease in there and stop the banging and groaning - and the noises the rudder makes too.

Kevin Wright
E35 Hydro Therapy
 

Glyn Judson

Moderator
Moderator
Grease fitting woes.

Kevin, If worse comes to worst, I have successfully cleaned out old Zerk fittings with paper clips, solvent and patience. At least you have the proper sized socket for the old one. Best of luck, Glyn
 

Kevin A Wright

Member III
Well after two days of work have a new zirk in place and pumped 2 1/2 14oz tubes of grease into the shaft. Resistance never increased but I also didn't see any grease coming out of the bottom of the shaft either. Not sure where it all went but figured that must be enough. Took a quick run and the rudder was working smoothly although I didn't have a following tide which is when I would notice the groaning and bumping before so time will tell.

Next time I do this I'm going to have to find a mechanically inclined 7 year old. If anyone has one you could rent them out at the marina.

Kevin Wright
E35 Hydro Therapy
 

Rocinante33

Contributing Partner
My boat also has a bushing at the top of the rudder post. It is the spot where the emergency tiller is placed when in use and it has a stainless deck plate cover over it.

When my boat was fairly new to me, the rudder was very stiff. I uncovered the top of the rudder post and squirted a half can of 3 in 1 oil onto it. It made a big difference.

I'm not sure if the E35 or the E38 have a similar design, but lube the top end of the rudder post if you can, too.
 

mjsouleman

Sustaining Member
Moderator
follow on

Thanks guys for the rudder/zerk discussion, seems the rudder is one of the most forgotten maintenance items on Ericsons.

When I get Discovery back in the water in October this is on my top 10 list.

mjs
 
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