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Giving up on my Atomic 4

rwthomas1

Sustaining Partner
I would not use any plastic for an engine mount backer. The whole point is that the backer stiffen the hull/transom where the mount is bolted on, correct? Well all the products mentioned are not particularly stiff compared to a piece of 3/4" Marine Grade plywood. A close second is a section of FRP board that McMaster sells. The only downfall to good old wood is it rots. Since this backer is vertical and above the waterline it will not be wet constantly. Properly sealed with epoxy and provided the mount attaching bolts are properly bedded the plywood backer will likely outlast your ownership and the next owner as well. Plywood is also readily available and easy to use. My 2cents, RT
 

Guy Stevens

Moderator
Moderator
Sika Flex 291 and Plywood

Both would serve well in this situation....

Coat it first with penetrating epoxy and then coat with west system, and paint it white...

They plastics will not hold up as well as a well coated plywood piece.

Guy
:)
 

Randy Rutledge

Sustaining Member
Art does your 29 have a tabernacle mounted mast and if so how much would it cost to get you to post pictures? In another thread you mentioned trailering the boat and building a trailer. My first bid for said pictures is a cold adult beverage of your choice.
 

wurzner

Member III
Not to beat a dead horse, but Starboard is very, very, very strong and stiff. The only problem is it is similiar in characteristics to PTFE. I have some 3/4 at home that I used to when replacing my wood hatches. I used the starboard to create a size that matches standard hatch openings. The stuff is REALLY good and designed specifically for marine applications. The reason I question the shear characteristics is my neighbor used it to make handrails on his CAL 34 and they now have stress cracks. I would not advise using it in that application. It has worked very well in the application I used it in. Also, keep in mind that all the motor brackets are using plastic to at the bracket/motor interface. I will say you will pay signicantly more for the starboard than you will for plywood. I'm not involved with starboard in any way, just a happy customer. Also, I prefer wood over plastic as well. I just think the wood will end up looking worse after a few attachment/detachments cycles and ulimately, the epoxy will allow moisture to penetrate. That will likely take a long time, but in our part of the world, we know moisture. When I bought my boat, there was moss and small mushrooms growing out of the handrails!

Just weighing in base on my use of the product.
 

Art Mullinax

Member III
Engine controls

Bryan,
You've heard from both ends of the spectrum concerning mounting the engine on the transom. You'll have to sift through the suggestions and see which one shakes out best for you. How are you planning to run the engine controls and fuel line? Will you go through the transom or over it? Seems like that would be a whole new set of issues? The E27 with the factory transom cutout wouldn't be a problem but from the topic that's not your case?
 

NateHanson

Sustaining Member
Not to beat a dead horse, but if it were me I'd probably pick up the A4 that the guy said he'd sell on the last page. Sounds like you'd put out only slightly more money than an appropriate outboard, and you'd save all the trouble of figuring out the mounting and controls for the outboard. In the end you'd have a boat that works better, and is more valuable.

Heck I'm tempted to buy it myself, but then I'd have to cut a hole in my hull and mount the engine right in the middle of the cabin! :)
 

hcpookie

Member III
NateHanson said:
Not to beat a dead horse, but if it were me I'd probably pick up the A4 that the guy said he'd sell on the last page. Sounds like you'd put out only slightly more money than an appropriate outboard, and you'd save all the trouble of figuring out the mounting and controls for the outboard. In the end you'd have a boat that works better, and is more valuable.

I completely agree with this. If it were my money (and MY first mate!) I'd swap engines. :D

That said, why don't you rebuild yours now? I'm surprised that paying for a rebuild would be so expensive - that's prohibitive no matter what the case. Even if it takes a good 3 months, rebuilding it yourself puts you in the water in April. Sounds like you've done all the "hard work" of learning the ins and outs of the engine, moreso than most I would bet. And that puts you ahead of the learning curve. Assuming you have access to engine rebuild tools (I can borrow most of mine) you could do this on the cheap.

THEN AGAIN - a rebuild may not be necessary. You never mentioned what is wrong with it. Maybe you only need a carb rebuild, or a new ignition system, maybe even a forehead-slapping issue like timing adjustment... or _______ ?

I'm not sure you want to go there, but if you could spend a week's worth of work on it, and a few hundred bucks and get it running, you'd be 2 steps ahead of the game, AND have preserved (or increased) the resale value!!! That's a win/win situation at the expense of a bit more patience and sleuth work on your end. And maybe a few hundred bucks.

IMO, You should really get it diagnosed to be sure you're going the right direction. That will let you make an educated decision... my $0.02 worth.
 

JAS

New Member
I don’t wish to discuss the advantages of an outboard verses an Atomic 4 but if someone chooses to go the outboard route I have a solution for the problem of getting cables and fuel line inside the hull.

For the fuel line I purchased a brass bulkhead fitting, I was unable to find a stainless steel unit, and mounted it in the stern with a fuel line quick disconnect coupling threaded into it on the outside and a flare fitting on the inside. I ran a copper line on the inside to a Racor filter mounted in the cockpit locker and then on to the tank. As you can see in the picture the fuel priming bulb is outside the hull and the fuel line can easily be removed from the outboard if one should choose to do so.

For the cables I simply drilled a hole, pulled in the cables and caulked it up. Then mounted a vent fitting to cover up the hole and caulk. The cables are bent over as they pass under the vent which prevents them from moving and the caulk prevents water and spiders from finding access inside.

I did not mount remote controls with this installation and would not recommend it. With the Yamaha 9.9 High Thrust the tiller mounted controls are easily operated from the cockpit.
 

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jkm

Member III
I once had a Catalina 27 with an outboard, I think it was a 12 hp.

Great for getting out of the harbor, but totally useless at sea. In any kind of a swell the prop was in the water about 65% of the time. Not what you want when you need a motor.

Here in Los Angeles we have many mechanics who grew up on A4s and would rebuild one, with original parts, for about $5/6,000.

One guy I know doesn't like Moyer Marine because of the aftermarket parts they use.

Don't take on another project. Find some old guy who wants to work on your A4. Pull it and let him rebuild it over the winter.

Even if your project goes bust you have a motor you could readily sell.

FWIW


JOhn
 

Jeff Asbury

Principal Partner
I vote No on OB for Coastal or Off Shore Sailing

Or you can cut out the transom like in this photo. This is Nigel's E-27 Green Card. I am sure the OB works great in Puget Sound but I would not want a OB on my E-27 for the Coastal Cruising here in LA. I got caught in a storm in 2001 on a 22 foot trailer sailor with a brand new Yamaha 4 stroke Long Shaft OB and it was totally useless. I tried using it for about 10 minutes until it over heated and started smoking. Even with a Long Shaft it spent more time out of the water when I had big swells and breaking seas.
 

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soup1438

Member II
Maybe an O/B is a good addition for other reasons?

I don't sail in the Pacific North-Wet. I sail in Florida. Sand, maybe some silt on the bottoms around the Tampa Bay area. If I have to deal with coral I'm not going to be as happy, I 'spect.

I have "upgraded" to a C-30 w/ an A4 from an E-25 with an 8HP Nissan.

Now, let me tell you what I think and you can decide whether I'm thinking straight or going off... ahem... half-cocked:

My C-30 has the full fin keel-- so I need 5'3" of water to float. My E-25 had a full keel too, needing 3'10" of water underneath it. My E-25 found the bottom more times than I care to admit, but, unlike the C-30, never needed to be towed off. I will *always* make sure I have some kind of towing coverage, at least here in Florida.

Why was I able to get off the bottom with my E-25?

Because the O/B can "vector" thrust and rotate the boat around the keel so it is pointing towards slightly deeper water.

Oh, yeah, this'd be useless if the bottom was stickier and I had a winged keel, but, hey, for some conditions, I really wish I had a reasonable mounting for a "reasonable" O/B that would be useful on the sailboat (when I don't need the "full grunt" of the inboard engine, for instance, or when I want a lighter touch) yet not too big for, say, a dinghy.

(laughs)

Mind you, I'd love to be able to have a swim platform, too, but, let's be realistic, here.

I would not want to write off the inboard given the sheer grunt it can apply but there are times I'd like to combine it with an outboard's ability to vector thrust w/o depending on the rudder.

So... my vote?

I'd want both.

Well, when I fantasize, I fantasize *big*.

I recognize the downside to the O/B... you need it to burn straight gasoline rather than the gasoline/oil mixture the 2-strokes use. (Do any 2strokes engines use oil injection yet? My brother had a Yamaha RD350 back in the early seventies that injected oil so there was no pre-mixing.) If you have both an inboard *and* an outboard, you want commonality of fuel supplies to make such a project "workable". (I'll leave the irritation of having a diesel inboard w/ the lamentations of not having a diesel engine in the outboard... though a jet engine burns the same variety of fuel, don't it?)

Now, admittedly, I've overhauled automobile engines (no, you don't want to hear me whining about how much I hate GM)... and personally want to scrounge up a re-buildable A4 that I could work on and then drop into my C-30 without taking a long outage.

But, hey, I'm a rag man at heart and *really* prefer to "stay on the rag" as long as possible... or get onto the rag ASAP on leaving the slip. An outboard, in good conditions, is adequate... and can be used for other jobs. (And, no, I would not use one to stir a jacuzzi.)

At best, though, I see an O/B as a kicker. I do *not* see it as a replacement for an inboard.
 
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Ron342

Member I
Cutting Boards & Winterizing the A-4??

Hey Brian - thats a great suggestion - maybe with big SS fender washers - I've been looking for something to make small hatch covers with and that might work - wonder about the sun effect??

Also just bought a E29 in Annapolis - Can anyone tell me how to winterize it - I'm pretty sure its sea water cooled???
Thanks
 
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