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1979 Ericson 27 for free from a friend who is moving... Good deal?

saswok

New Member
This would be my first sailboat but I am pretty handy. The boat needs some work like the PO had a leak professionally fixed and had the driveshaft removed to fix but it would not align when they tried to reinstall due to the motor mounts being corroded. Has new alternator but he also stated the motor yanmar 1gm I believe runs but needs some work. I found a motor kit for $650 and another kit for 600 with no piston and rings.
I also found better motor mounts for $500 as the OEM ones are $400 and updated impellar cover with thumbscrews for $100. Total so far $1200
I also read that these motors usually have head issues not lower end. Read these are pretty easy to work on.
Another option is to put a Yamaha extra long shaft 9.9hp high thrust outboard and bracket on the back.
The reason I'm considering this is it would suck to rebuild the motor and have it be unreliable.

Question 1: are these motors stout enough (worth) rebuilding? If I do it right will it last?
I like the idea of diesel onboard vs gas and it's already set up...
Question 2: I know it will need other things maybe paint etc. And these can add up but what are some problem areas to check that can be costly to fix beyond the mechanical?
Question 3: a family member who has a sailboat told me TO RUN away these are only worth around $5k to $7k
In good condition (I saw a really nice one for 18k though)
Would getting this boat for free and trying to fix it for cheap lo learn to sail on be a terrible idea or sometimes do the boat God's shine on you and you don't have many problems that cost a fortune to fix?

I am going to look at it on Thursday and will be taking a bazillion pics. getting a boat survey on a free boat that needs work for 600-700$ seems like that $ could be spent
On some parts or services...(am I crazy)

I am new to these forums and have been reading two days straight but any help would be greatly appreciated!
 

markvone

Sustaining Member
Ahh - The FREE boat question!

Saswok,

Let me start with a few points:

The cost of boat ownership in money and time/effort needs to be less than the joy of using it, hanging out on it and the enjoyment of (if applicable) working on it.

You will have to decide if the time/effort of maintenance/projects goes on the cost or the joy side of the equation.

A boat is a money pit that can steal your soul.

Even with an Ericson, there is generally no breaking even or coming out ahead financially, you just control the amount you lose while you enjoy it.

Question #3 - yes, a nice, functional E27 is worth $5-7k, can go for < $1k (or free in your case) which doesn't help resale. Functional = has working motor (OB/IB gas/IB diesel, they came with all three) , has mast, boom, lines and sails so it can sail. Nice = decent looking hull and deck, not a wreck, interior wood not rotten, cushions and fabric presentable, stove/grill, sink/water system, head/porta-potti, cushions to sit sleep on for overnighting, a few extras like depth sounder, VHF, etc. Could you add this stuff to your free boat for less than $5-7k, doing all the labor yourself? If not, would you get $5 -7k worth of enjoyment out of doing it, knowing that money wasn't coming back? Could you go find a $5k E27 that was already there - probably yes.

Question #1 - I had a 1GM Yanmar in my E26 and loved it. I would research the crap out of rebuilding one (cost and reliability after) before I would spend ANY money. A diesel IB is nicer but probably not worth anymore to a buyer than a new Yamaha 9.9 OB. Would you enjoy removing and rebuilding and reinstalling the 1GM for the cost of the job, knowing that money wasn't coming back?

Question #2 - Expensive, shall we say "potentially fatal" (as in near the value of the boat) things to be aware of. There are more with a lower value boat. Engine - see Question #1, Small boats with outboards get a break here, my E36 isn't selling without a working inboard diesel. Mast and rigging - see this recent thread about an E27 broken mast: http://www.ericsonyachts.org/infoexchange/showthread.php?16054-Boat-damage
with 1300 E27s built, cannabilizing another E27 for a mast is possible. Hull blisters if extensive - this freaks buyers out and they will have lots of other E27s to choice from. You can just sail it as-is and keep your money. Isolated blisters get fixed, hidden and become the next owners problem later. Less expensive items: new sails if existing are junk, running rigging, interior cushions.

Sorry to sound so harsh, but there is a reason buying a boat is one of the two happiest days of your life and selling it is the other. People buy boats mostly on emotion and if the realities of the expenses are not considered, the emotions can turn from good to bad. Understanding what you're getting into makes for a better decision. If you real want a project and like doing them (I do) then understanding what they will cost ahead of time and before you are committed makes for a better decision.

Mark
 
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saswok

New Member
Thank you!

Even before I posted this I knew I was 95% was not going to get this boat.I am not like the others hoping you guys will talk me out of it. I was wondering if it was possible that there was any positive things to look for to talk me into it. Someday I will get a sailboat and I was using this as a trial run to learn as much as I can. It is working
I will probably eventually buy a boat that someone else has put their blood sweat and tears into and is in great shape like I'm supposed to. But in the 1% chance this boat is not the gift horse everyone thinks it is (including me) was hoping to have some general knowledge so I am not that guy that passes up on a boat that is in decent condition besides the motor... I found an outboard 2014 Yamaha 9.9hp extra long for $1800 so for around $2800 I can solve the auxiliary power...
I have read some about blisters and chain something or rathers being of bad design and and can break causing extensive damage etc. Soft spots in the deck or anywhere.
Just trying to get some general knowledge about problem areas on these boats so like I said on the 1% chance the boat God's have shined upon me I'm not the idiot who passed on the deal. I'm in no hurry but you would be amazed how lucky I am sometimes that even I can't believe it... I do understand this will most likely not be the case
Your help is not wasted here though as someday I will find a beautiful boat to put my blood sweat and tears into as a tribute to my late grandfather who was a true seaman.
Thanks again I'll be reading for now.
 

markvone

Sustaining Member
Saswok,

Sounds like you have it figured out. There can be tremendous deals on boats out there. Sometimes people just have enough emotionally and the boat has to go! If the boat is in good to average condition with no major problems, it's probably a great deal. My experience is that when people get fed up with their boat, more often it takes them awhile to realize it's time to sell, sometimes it takes a long time. Meanwhile they have stopped all improvements and upgrades and probably a lot of the expensive maintenance. The boat degrades over this time, maybe it's leaking in a few places and soaking some wood trim or the floor. Eventually, the boat is less than average and getting worse, hard to sell and not a deal.

If you can find that loved, highly maintained and upgraded boat that is somebody's baby, that is the boat I look for. Even at a premium price you'll still be spending a ton less than the current owner spent on his/her baby.

You can add wet decks or wet hull core to that list of bad things that are potentially expensive to fix. On a smaller boat with less interior in the way, and a smaller area to fix, this job is easier for a DIY. On a larger boat with a full interior it gets to be a big job fast and expensive to pay a professional to fix.

Mark
 

Kevin A Wright

Member III
The E27 is a very nice boat. Skookum built and works nicely in the waters of the PNW. I sailed one for 25 years and only the addition of 3 grandkids made me move on to another boat.

One big thing to think of is where are you going to keep this? If in a marina you will need insurance. And to get insurance you will need to have a survey done. You should also figure out the cost of mooring the thing since it can be a very large part of the cost of ownership. And moorage around Seattle isn't cheap.

If you can keep it outside of a marina and work on it yourself, the two things I'd look at on an E27 are blisters on the bottom and wet deck cores.

These boats are built well and have a solid FRP hull with an encapsulated keel. That eliminates a lot of potential problems right there. If you have a few blisters that is not expensive or hard to fix yourself if it is on the hard. If you have a lot it is still fixable but a long and dirty process since you will have to grind off the old gelcoat, fix the blisters and do an epoxy barrier coat to keep them away. I did my own and it was a pain, took me about 2 weeks but again, not all that expensive if you aren't paying for labor. They seem to be most prevalent on the aft edge of the keel where the bilge is. The rest of the keel is lead. So a hollow sound on the aft edge is normal (had a surveyor who didn't seem to know that once).

The E27 does have a balsa cored deck. So if there is any sign of water getting into the interior through the chainplate area or deck fittings but REAL suspicious. Also look really close around where the chainplates enter the deck. These spots were just caulked to keep water out. Take a small hammer and tap around these areas to see if it sounds substantially different than the rest of the deck or is spongy when you stand on it (indicating water intrusion). You can fix this yourself too especially if the spot is small and localized, but personally even at free I'd draw the line at tackling this job up front if you find extensive areas of deck rot. There are a lot of these boats out there.


Good Luck!


Kevin Wright
E35 Hydro Therapy
 

G Kiba

Sustaining Member
saswok,

I have owned my 73' E27 since 2003. And like your situation, it was a free boat as well as my first. I had surfed and windsurfed for years but knew very little about sailing or owning a boat. Except... I knew that I would like sailing and I'm somewhat handy. My E27 has a decent hull and deck but that was about it. Not perfect but not a total wreck.

Knowing the value of my E27 I willingly spent a lot of money on her and would do it again without a thought. I worked on her through that first winter and spring -cleaning, reading, repairing and learning. I almost gave up. That is until I made some new sailing friends and stated sailing it more than working on it. From that point on... new outboard, new running and standing rigging. New sails! Yes!

For me the E27 is the perfect FIRST boat.
Things I am grateful for that I didn't know I would be? My E27 is simple. Outboard motor (Tohatsu 9.9 bought in 06 flawless to date), Tiller (no complicated wheel and a lot of room in the cockpit), Porta-potty (No holding tank), no keel bolts (nuff said).

AND most important...all the lessons learned, all the good times (some scary), all the adventures, and all the family bonding with its stories to tell and keep telling.

Chain plates are all original and spreader brackets have not dimpled the mast! (two of E27 owners biggest worries)
Bruce King knew what he was doing! He designed a boat that was easy to maintain and super fun and safe to sail.
People over tighten the rig...dimples! People over worry about the chain plates. The amount of service they have given is spectacular. When/if they fail on me...well maybe it's time for another boat? Yep, it's only worth 5-7K. Right!

forward reef lines.jpgFullSizeRender (2).jpggrants_Ericson27.jpg
 

nquigley

Sustaining Member
My 2c would be:

first penny: ask yourself, "How soon do I want to actually go sailing?" (accepting that boat ownership is an ongoing mixture of repair/maintenance and actual sailing - just gotta get the balance that's right for you)
--> I'm going to assume you want to get out sailing with the family in a reliable and safe boat that's suited to your current needs as soon as reasonably possible, instead of possibly spending the next 12 months fixing a boat and spending a fortune doing so. Then you can start eying the next size up in a few years.

second penny: take the advice of veteran ocean cruisers, Lin and Larry Pardey: Go small, go simple, go now!” (from their book, “Cruising in Seraffyn”)
 
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