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In water rudder tube Zerk install E 35 mk 2

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Tomwine

Member II
Has anyone installed a zerk into their rudder tube on an E 35 mk 2 while the boat is still in the water. I have talked with Christian and Ignacio about this procedure and Christian said he did it on a E 38 or his 32 which is a different animal and Ignacio did his 35 on the hard. I drilled a small pilot hole about 3 inches below the top of the tube and water started coming out of the hole. Thank god it used a small bit. I patched the hole and put on my thinking cap on "which is pretty small" to try and figure out how to complete this project without hauling the boat out of the water. It seemed when I drilled the hole that the water would pulsate as the boat moved up and down which made me think I was pretty close to the waterline. I have thought about putting a few large trash cans on the bow of the boat and removing all of the stuff I have stored in the stern lockers to see if the stern would lift up enough to clear that water line so I can epoxy the zerk in without water getting in the way. If anyone here has installed a zerk on their E 35 in the water and can offer me some ideas it will be much appreciated. Christian's great photos and instructions on doing this on his 32 or 38 were a great help in understanding how to prevent the tube from leaking. I have repacked mine and it still leaks so I'm sure this is the fix to stopping this aggravating problem. While sailing Bilge pump works pretty hard taking care of water coming from rudder tube. When boat is going slow almost no water comes in.
Thanks for any help
Tom Winesett
Hot Tamale
74 E 35 # 317
 

Loren Beach

O34 - Portland, OR
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
I was once part of a crew of five guys that stood on the bow of a boat to raise the stern up several inches so that the top of the rudder shaft could be inspected.
Some of your friends might be able to do this while you have your drill and zerk fitting all ready to go. That lower grease fitting should not take too long.
:confused:
 

Tomwine

Member II
Rudder Tube Zerk

I was once part of a crew of five guys that stood on the bow of a boat to raise the stern up several inches so that the top of the rudder shaft could be inspected.
Some of your friends might be able to do this while you have your drill and zerk fitting all ready to go. That lower grease fitting should not take too long.
:confused:
Great idea but I'm not sure if I could afford enough beer and cocktails for that many of my friends to stand on the bow for an hour.?
 

bgary

Advanced Beginner
Blogs Author
When I was putting in a raw-water strainer, my reading indicated it was important to have the clean-out above waterline. I took a straight-edge (in my case, an 8-foot length of aluminum angle I had in the garage), laid it across the companionway rails, and measured the distance from the rail to the water outside the boat.

Then I measured the same distance down from the rail *inside* the boat and put a piece of blue-tape at that height (on the inside edge of the galley cabinet was handy, in my case, because that's where I was working)

Pretty easy, now, to see whether something is above or below waterline by referencing that blue-tape line. (It's sort of surprising how far "up" the waterline actually is when you're inside the boat)

$.02
Bruce
 

Tomwine

Member II
in water rudder tube zerk

Can anybody confirm that on this model the top of the rudder tube is in fact below the waterline?
Christian I'm pretty sure the top of the rudder tube is above the water line, when I replace the packing water was not coming in. I do know that when I drilled the small hole 3 inches below the gland water was coming in.
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Might it be trapped water?

Anyhow, I might be tempted to drill for the new Zerk anyhow ,and perform the surgery with bleeding. Epoxy will cure in water, and there wouldn;t be much pressure. (There are epoxies specifically for use underwater, in swimming pools)

You could stick the new Zerk in the hole and strap it down while it cured.

Just something I might try--an untested theory.
 

Tomwine

Member II
Will be traveling down to boat this weekend to try the water filled trash cans on the bow. I hope this will get the rudder up far enough to not have to work with water coming into the hole.
Thanks for all of your help and thoughts.
T
 

Kevin A Wright

Member III
Really the right way to do it is to tap the hole and thread the zerk in. You can do that while it leaks with no problem. Then you can replace the zerk when it eventually cruds up. If you are concerned about not enough meat on the shaft tube, tap in a SS pipe nipple and then reinforce that joint with epoxy. That's what I've got on my E35. Again that way you can replace the zerk easily when it cruds up.

Kevin Wright
E35 Hydro Therapy
 

Tomwine

Member II
Thanks Kevin
That sounds like one of the best ideas I have heard so far. I hate to ask you but is there anyway you could take a picture of where you put your zerk? My 35 2 is a 74 when I drilled the small hole it didnt seem to go in very far before water was coming out. I did hit the shaft with the drill and was so excited about the water coming in I broke the bit off in the tube. The drill bit was almost out when it broke so it was not rubbing on the post. I just glassed it in where it was. The Zerk I purchased was a stainless steel 3/4 in which is bigger than I needed but I thought the epoxy would be easier seal up the larger zerk. I was not planning on tapping but just using a small bit and a forsman bit to drill the 3/4 in partial flat hole to install the zerk. After thinking about your great idea I will probably use a smaller zerk and tap into the tube. Where would I find a nipple that would be the same thread as the zerk or did you have to thread the nipple on both ends male and female?
Thanks again for your thoughts and if you can crawl back into the tomb and get a pic I would sure appreciate it. If not I completely understand. When I am done with this project I really don't want to work back there again until I refill the zerk. LOL
This is the last project after almost 2 years of fixing the boat up that I have to complete before using it often. The water coming in from the tube was a real fun stopper in the past. The faster the boat went the more water that came in.
Tom
 

Kevin A Wright

Member III
Sorry, I'm not near the boat and won't be until Friday. If I remember right it was placed about 1/3 of the way up from the hull, but I think anywhere below the packing gland near the deck should be fine. In reality you are going to put it anywhere you can actually reach it to work on. On my 35-3 it is above the water line so never even had water coming through when I replaced the zerk. Mine was already installed but hadn't been used probably since installation by the looks of it. Zerk totally rusted shut and when I got that unscrewed the old grease had hardened into a plug the consistency of epoxy and had to be drilled out. (Want to guess how many 1 hour trips home for different tools and entry/egress from that lazarette all that took? %$#&*@&!* ).

You can get zerks that are standard pipe thread. I believe mine was 1/4" NPT but might have been 1/8" pipe thread. So a short ss nipple with a ss union on the end. Thread/epoxy the nipple to the shaft tube and screw the zerk into the union. Then get ready to shove about 2 full tubes of grease in.

Once you've got that nipple and union in there the next thought is to run a tube or pipe up from it to the top of the lazarette. So you just open the hatch and give it a few shots of grease every spring rather than crawling down in there. Would be much more likely to get done. Unless you happen to be 3 feet tall with 6 foot long arms with a double set of elbows with eyes on the end of movable stalks.

Kevin Wright
E35 Hydro Therapy
 

Tomwine

Member II
Great Idea. My boat is 240 miles from me so I drive about 5 miles to the home depot every time I need something while i'm on the boat. Seems like about one trip every two or three hours to Home Depot for most projects. I think I have more tools and parts on my boat and dock box now than in my garage at home. I will let you know how this works in a few weeks when I go to the boat. I will get a tap and die kit and do all of my planning and a trial run on some wood here at home so I can avoid a few trips to the Depot.
Thanks Much
Tom
 

unequaltee

Member II
Thinking outside the tube

Hi, I have used an old screw type stern tube greaser mounted in an easy to reach area, and I used a piece of stainless flat drilled and tapped to the thread of the fitting (or zerk) Glued and glassed it to the tube with a bolt in place of the fitting with release agent on it to keep the threads clean . To avoid a water leak this could all be done before drilling a smaller hole into the tube and quickly screwing in the zerk.
Ian
 

Tomwine

Member II
Thanks for another great idea. I think I am going to tap a zerk into the tube epoxy around it and see if that works. Going to place a few large trash cans full of water on the bow of the boat to see if I can lift the stern up enough to not have water coming in while drilling and tapping.
T
 

admirals barge

Member III
parts

you can go to gsa on Anaheim blvd..across from the shell station/ carls jr. they have every fitting, bolt, screw that exists.. also stainless fittings… the stainless is way cheaper then west marine.....

good luck waiting to see how you make out..so I can do it...i'm at newmarks….saw your boat when it was on the hard
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Gentlemen,

It's a discussion forum, so--

I can't see tapping threads into a rough, hand-layup rudder tube. Will it work? Maybe. Depends on the thread count and the solidity of the tube. Point is, you'll never take it out, so why thread it in?

Weigh down the bow with the garbage-can water suggestion, to get the tube dry ( which isn;t all that necessary anyhow).

Drill the hole for the body of the Zerk, then continue with a quarter-inch bit to reach the rudder post.

Epoxy the Zerk into the hole.

If you don't like the job, seal the hole and start over one inch away.

Also, I like Kevin's pipe nipple idea, since you're doing this anyhow.

I think Ericson did that on some boats. I have a factory-installed half-inch bronze female fitting glassed into the tube, which is sealed with a threaded bronze plug.

I only screw in the nipple (the Zerk) when applying grease.

.
 
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bgary

Advanced Beginner
Blogs Author
Dumb question #4,319: Do zerk fittings come in different sizes? (I mean the grease-gun side. I know the threaded side comes in different sizes)

In other words, when I go out to get a grease gun, do I need to make sure it has a coupling or tip that matches the specific zerk on the boat in order to seal, or is the working end “standard”?

And for bonus-points, is there a “right” kind of grease to pump into a rudder tube in salt-water? Some sort of special marine-grade stuff, or just a tube or two of whatever the local auto-parts store carries?
 
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Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
When my tip didn't fit the Zerk, I found various-sized replacement tips at a chain auto parts store.

I've been using the green WM cartridges in my dainty 3 oz quick-draw grease gun. That's my technical specification: "green grease."

Found some photos of the E38 factory grease fitting, and even of the larger "coupler" for the grease gun.

1-greaseIMG_1357.JPGE38 Rudder Tube Zerk Thelonious II.jpg
 
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