Companionway hatch veneer top

I'd like to sharpen up the look of the companionway hatch on my 27. The hatch is in good structural shape, but the large piece on top look to be a teak plywood that has been sanded through over the years. What am I getting into if I try to replace just that piece? Could I just start by prying up one corner that is raising up, and pull the whole piece up and the replace? Or is that going to require taking the whole thing apart? And does anyone know the thickness of the piece? There's a good supplier in town that advertises 1/8" and 1/4" teak plywood.

Of course I could leave well enough alone and varnish what I have but what's the fun in that. Thanks. Jay

I can imagine myself thinking just as you are. What can improve this without making a whhle new hatch?

My thoughts would run sorta like this:

Well, I can get the plywood off the frame somehow. Either it pulls up fairly easily, or I wind up with a chisel and patience. If tests indicate a big issue, just stop.

First question is, what is the thickness of the laminate, and can I find replacement sheet in the same thickness? Plywood dimensions measurements have changed over the years, mm replacing fractions. Also, some listed ply thickness is not actually accurate. Caliper gauge shows reality on the boat and on the replacement. We just can't sand or plane these laminates much.

I'd also consider some test varnish, after some test bleaching. You can reveal how wood will look when varnished by wiping it with alcohol. It may look really ugly.

If yes, I'd probably paint. Prepare surface with filler, sand, then Interlux PreCoat. This is the primer for Interlux Brightside, a modern one-part paint that comes out as hard and shiny as gelcoat. Amazing stuff.

The PreCoat prep leaves a build between sandings that eventually makes a flawless surface. Brightside requires three coats. It will last for years in sun, but of course you'll be making a Sunbrella anti-UV hatch cover for the new hatch anyhow.

I wouldn't tackle any of this on the boat. Need a home environment to do it right.

I found it easier to make a whole new one on my E27. Used a piece of 3/4 teak ply that I cut kerfs on the inside to allow it to bend. Filled in the kerfs with 5200 so it looked like teak and holly planking on the inside but solid on the outside. The outer frame was just solid teak so not a lot of solid to buy.

If you look at your original the plywood is screwed in place with the screws covered with bungs. You can try pulling all the bungs and taking the screws out to try to salvage the frame if you want. Easiest way to do that is to chuck up a wood screw in your drill. When it drills down and hits the screw head it keeps pulling the bung out.

Good luck

Kevin Wright
ex E27 Wright Off

I went with a Gray Lexan hatch cover

I am a bit envious of all the guys who have made immaculate reproductions of the original hatch. But on the other hand, i can't help thinking that if the original was really a good design, we wouldn't all have to be replacing and rebuilding them...

Lack of proper maintenance

toddster said:

I am a bit envious of all the guys who have made immaculate reproductions of the original hatch. But on the other hand, i can't help thinking that if the original was really a good design, we wouldn't all have to be replacing and rebuilding them...

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The teak companionway hatch and boards on the 73' E-27 I had came to me in perfect condition. I passed them on to the next owner in perfect condition. You have to take care of these things. Some folks are willing to put forth the effort and some are not. The design is not the fault. Lack of proper maintenance is. If you don't want to or can't maintain varnished woodwork don't buy a boat that has it. It's as simple as that.

Properly Maintained

Here is what the 40+ year old hatch and boards looked like when I sold the 73' E-27

So here's what I did to my companionway hatch

For many (or most) of you, this is the stuff of high school woodshop. I had one quarter of a school year of woodshop in 7th grade in which I made a checkerboard. So each step of the way on this simple fix was anything but simple to me and I'm still not done. I also had the guidance of an acquaintance who is shipwright. He helped me with the free hand cuts and kerfs and inserting. Someone had a sheet of cabin sole left over and I bought it cheap. I cut out the majority of the old top (seen in post #1) and then I went at the edges that were attached to the frame. I was amazed at the work that went into the original work. More than I expected. The top ply panel was glued and had at least 24 tiny brass screws. And numerous dowels along the edge of the frame covered by bungs, which explained why I couldn't remove them using the drill out method. Then the teak veneer over top. Took a day to get that out without damaging the frame. Then I made a template with some foam board that my wife uses to make presentations at her work. The aft edge of the hatch is bowed, something I hadn't noticed until I started seriously contemplated making the improvement. Then we cut the sole material. Amazingly, we only needed a bit of sanding to make it fit. We also made 12 kerf cuts on the underside. It was amazing to me how those cuts made that stiff sole bend. (I have more than half a sheet left over if anyone is interested).

Now I have to gird up my loins to countersink some screws through the edges of the material and into the frame. I'd like to skip the dowel step because I can't imagine squarely hitting the side of the 1/2" panel (almost half of which is rabetted). There shouldn't be a problem with countersinking into this sole material correct? It's done all the time I assume. And I planned on using brass screws and teak plugs.

Jay

You might also consider bronze screws without plugs. Countersunk flush they look really good, although the price per screw will make you gasp.

My sliding hatch is absolutely falling to pieces. I've decided I'm replacing it with a flat top, because it is so much easier.

How sacrilegious is this?

Lookin' good Jay.

Hi Adam,

I think you will want at least a little curve on the top. Water won't drain very well with a flat top and the pooling water will cause problems with your finish. Also I don't think you will like the look, there was a flat companionway hatch on my E27 when I bought it and it looked pretty funky.

Here's a photo of the flat hatch. It doesn't look as bad in the photo as I remember but it did leak like a sieve!

That's what I meant, bronze...

I'm still learning...I say brass when I mean bronze. sheesh. I think what I"m going to do is use silicon bronze wood screws (slotted because I think they look nicer). I spent the early morning looking at some scrap pieces that we used to test fit. And I'm convinced that reinforcing from the side with dowels would be a mistake. No room for error and I'd only be comfortable using 3/16" dowels, which seems like not a good risk reward trade off.

So I plan on the screws. I'd prefer to place them only the port starboard sides of the frame to reinforce most directly against the flex. however, there where is only about a .3" of frame to grip into. But it seems to me that the correctly sized bronze screws along the forward and aft edges will provide enough reinforcement, and there is enough frame material to adequately screw into.

Thanks, Christian, for the suggestion because with a less than half an inch of the sole material I don't think using plugs is a good idea.

Two questions:

Is it a good idea to insert screws and then varnish, or varnish and then insert screws? Not sure if it's wise to varnish over the bronze screws. Seems like the varnish might not grip the metal same.

And what might be the best way to seal the seam between the frame and the top? Would varnish do it? or is it best to tape and drizzle (for lack of a better term) epoxy into the gap, or something else. The seam is not unsightly, about 1/32" (1/8" in a few spots) but plenty for water to seep in.

Thanks. Jay

JPS27 said:

I'd like to sharpen up the look of the companionway hatch on my 27. The hatch is in good structural shape, but the large piece on top look to be a teak plywood that has been sanded through over the years. What am I getting into if I try to replace just that piece? Could I just start by prying up one corner that is raising up, and pull the whole piece up and the replace? Or is that going to require taking the whole thing apart? And does anyone know the thickness of the piece? There's a good supplier in town that advertises 1/8" and 1/4" teak plywood.

Of course I could leave well enough alone and varnish what I have but what's the fun in that. Thanks. Jay

View attachment 22592View attachment 22593

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If all the substrate is sound you could buy teak veneer and epoxy it on, you could do all necessary repairs first , make true and fair , and then epoxy veneer on sand and varnish. should be like new.

Mark F said:

Here's a photo of the flat hatch. It doesn't look as bad in the photo as I remember but it did leak like a sieve!

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Here's a photo of my hatch. The rot is so bad the sides have fallen off it and there's almost a hole in the top. I need replacement before winter, and I've got a bunch of other projects to work on so I want to spend minimal time on a hatch. A simple square one seem more than good enough.

Why did it leak so badly? Was it water splashing when sailing and getting through the gap between the deck and the hatch?

Re: simple square hatch. Your boat may be a little different, but the deck camber of my E29 precluded a simple box. Although I suppose you could cut a curved opening in the bottom of such a box, it would have to be quite tall.

I'm not particularly proud of this but Winter Was Coming and it solved the problem: So I made a simple dog-house shape. IIRC, the angle of the peak is 11° which more or less (to me) matches the shape of the house, and it sheds rain. With 3/4" rails and 3/8" plywood panels, rabbeted construction and a layer of fiberglass over all, it's rock-solid to stand on, for example, while flaking the sail. Although, I do consider this one of those "temporary measures," it's stood up to abuse for more than five years now with no maintenance. I stuck in some scraps of garage-door gasket to close the gap between the curved cabin and the straight hatch - this might even help with a nice curved hatch.

*Ahem* speaking of deferred maintenance... didn't I refinish those hatch boards just a few months ago? Oh, I guess 50 is "a few..." I was going to replace them, too. Temporary measures...

Weathered hatch boards.

Something to bear in mind is that the OEM supplier, H&L Marine is long out of business. Now, I know that others could make them if need be for you today but regardless of who, it would cost a small fortune. Treat your drop boards lovingly, breathe new life into them and they will serve you well forever. To paraphrase Loren, my 2 cents worth. Photo of ours attached. Glyn

Actually, the drop boards, like the hatch, were pretty much a pile of kindling when the boat came to me. The bottom two are glued together with 5200 - a temporary measure which has worked surprisingly well.
The plan for this season was to build and install the next-generation hatch boards, so I could take the old ones home for another refurb. Yeah, that hasn't happened. I'm still repairing last winter's storm damage around the hacienda and Winter Is Coming again.

Oh, BTW, not only does rain seep in through these aft-angled drop boards but it turns out, so does ash. (It has been raining ash from forest fires for the last month.) There is always a little pile of fine ash below the hatch when I open it up. A truly water-tight design would be nice.

toddster said:

Re: simple square hatch. ...I made a simple dog-house shape. IIRC, the angle of the peak is 11° which more or less (to me) matches the shape of the house, and it sheds rain. With 3/4" rails and 3/8" plywood panels, rabbeted construction and a layer of fiberglass over all, it's rock-solid to stand on, for example, while flaking the sail.

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Thanks Todd. That's looking like a good alternative.

But FYI, here's a friend's Ericson 35 with a flat topped hatch.

It's definitely a bit tall, and it has a sea hood protecting it from leaking...