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Ground tackle set up

JPS27

Member III
Quick background. I'm a relative newbie to sailing anything other than a dinghy. I've had my '77 E27 for about 2 years (coming to my third summer) and anything beyond day sailing has been to sail to other marinas. Starting this spring I plan to do some weekends to spots where I can (and must) anchor out. My questions are about my ground tackle set up. I'm sure I don't know all I should know yet, although, I've been learning and thinking about it a lot. My experience thus far is anchoring in the James for a picnic, or for the shear practice of anchoring.

I have a danforth style anchor pictured. I don't know it's weight, which is pretty irresponsible I realize. It feels to be in the 20 lb range (probably not more). My anchor rode consists of about 20 feet of chain and a 100 feet of anchor rode. I do not have an anchor roller.

My questions are:

It seems risky to me to have my rode cleat hitched to my bow cleat only. What should that set up look like? Do I need some sort of anchor snubber set up, and if so what would that look like?

I'm wondering if a fortress anchor might make life a bit easier if I have to be at the helm (likely) and my wife needs to pull up the anchor. She's much more nervous at the helm. Thoughts on the fortress? (side note: based on my marina survey, the plow anchor is favored all though both types are visible. However, boats with plow anchors tend to be larger AND have rollers to accommodate them. I want to save the cost of figuring out a roller on my boat for a future date).

What other questions should I be asking?

Thanks in advance.

Jay
IMG_7450.jpg
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Huge topic. Practical Sailor has tested anchors against each other and so data exists if you are inclined to study it.

Local practice, based on local issues, is more useful my book. Weeds, mud, rocks, eel grass, depth of water, all big factors.

Most people carry more rode than you have , for minimum 7:1 boat length depth ratio. A boat length of chain, more or less.

All-Nylon rode stretches so a snubber is not needed with it.

In my experience there's a big difference between a Danforth and a Danforth knock-off. I've had both at once, they looked the same, and the Danforth
held and the knock-off didn't.

Unless cruising afar, simplicity trumps weight and complication and that goes for the cleats, too. A bridle on two bow cleats is OK if not anchoring in a gale.

I ask somebody to motor the boat towards the hook when retrieving. It isn't much to ask since they don't really have to steer and idle rpms is often enough, and you can call out instructions.

I don't invite anybody else to deal with the anchor at the bow, where patience, mud, and multiple options are often present.

Anchoring in unfamiliar waters builds confidence, is fun, and is always accompanied by low grade anxiety about whether the hook is holding at 3 a.m.
 

Loren Beach

O34 - Portland, OR
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Attaching yourself to the ground

We have threads here about anchors and rollers, so some searching may help.
Basic Anchoring Stuff (imho) is still about the same for most smaller boats.
While your wife might be nervous about running the controls while you handle the anchor gear, it is mostly the 'fear of the unknown' that can, with soft words and practice, be overcome.

Perhaps you have a local bay or inlet where you can go and refine your technique. My wife drives while I deploy and retrieve our anchor, and given that even though I am not young or strong anymore, it's the only practical way to do this. She is considerably shorter and less "able" to do foredeck work.
We always have the engine warmed up, and I work the bow and use hand signals to "talk" to her at her end of the boat. It's just basic "crane signals" -- point up for put in forward gear, clenched fist for neutral, point down for reverse, and point to one side or the other for steering. Engine is going to be at idle speed for this chore, anyway. If it's windy and the bow tries to blow off, at some point I will look back and ask for more rpm's for a few seconds to bring the bow back up.

Departing often calls for 1- creeping up on the line while I haul it in, 2- my snubbing off the line when the anchor is stuck in mud, 3- her momentarily increasing forward rev's then to break it out, 4- then maintaining very slow forward if needed for control in a wind while I haul in the last of the line and chain.
Once the whole mess is on the foredeck, I use a bucket or two to wash off the mud. Foul bottom material can result in foul language directed directed at the foul mud. :rolleyes:

After a long afternoon of reading and napping or a night or two peacefully watching the distance marsh (and often spotting an eagle) it's worth the effort to bring up the anchor.
Marinas are great for stores, restaurants, and showers ashore, but even these luxuries come packaged with occasional steep learning curves and new vexations... wobbly docks with cleats in goofy places, cross winds, narrow fair ways, and sometimes noisy neighbors. Anchoring out can have real advantages.

Your anchor appears to be more than adequate for your boat - quite large, actually.
If your typical bottom material is sand or mud, a Danforth 12 or 13 would be fine, too. You might want to check the places that sell used and consignment gear for one.
I used a Danforth 8 for our prior 26 foot sailboat for decade, but it was much lighter than your boat, at under 5K displacement.

One rule-of-thumb is a foot of chain for every foot of waterline, so you are OK for summer cruising IMHO.
We have 250' of three-strand, and I would not want to have less. But then our boat weighs over 10K, and has more windage overall. We have a Danforth 12H, and 30 feet of chain. I have deployed almost all of this scope for a 30 kt plus afternoon one time, in 20 feet of water. The rode was pulled tight and straight. One thing I did after a few years was to add an anchoring sail to stop the boat from sailing from side to side in any wind.

There are multiple facets to your questions, and really there are multiple correct answers. Finally, the information here is worth about what you are paying!
:)

Regards,
Loren
 

Emerald

Moderator
I'm thinking you are going to be anchoring in what I consider a typical Chesapeake anchorage, which means a muddy bottom and probably 10+ feet of water. A real Danforth should be fine with enough scope - you do want at least the 7:1 Christian mentions, so I'd make a real measurement of your rhode and have at least 150 feet of it (100 seems a bit tight, but doable). You should have backing plates on the bow cleats already, but check to be sure. That's easy to add if they are not there. You are on the right track to do some practice when you have flexibility - seek out some nice coves for a lunch/afternoon on the hook, and do some runs where you can dial it in and not find out at 3AM you messed up as you start dragging. Watch out for enough room to swing as wind direction changes etc. There's nothing like practice to get comfortable. You will find that sometimes it is hard to get a bite, and other times it will dig in like you can't believe. Backing down with your engine when you think you have it set will often confirm and make sure you get a nice bite, but don't over do it. Remember, you can drive the boat forward (gently) to help break it free - and by this I mean get positioned so you are pulling ever so slightly forward e.g. you are still over the anchor with the rhode near vertical. Hope this helps and others will probably add some more thoughts on technique and experience.
 

alcodiesel

Bill McLean
Hey Jay, c'mon over to Willoughby Bay to practice "sea and anchor" drills. It's enclosed, big, has minimal wave action and no ship traffic.
 

JPS27

Member III
Bill, will do! As I was driving to ODU today and by your marina, I was thinking of stopping by and taking a look at your boat. I may just leave a bit early and do that today. I'll admit, the one time I've hit bottom in the 2+ years I've had Southpaw was when I was heading into Willoughy channel. Got too far to the HRBT side at the mouth. Will you be there this afternoon?
 

JPS27

Member III
Al, Really? That's great. I'm a department chair. If they ever need anything let me know. I love to help students negotiate the sometimes byzantine world of higher education. It's my mission. Do they sail, we have a top notch sailing team with world class coaches.
Jay
 

alcodiesel

Bill McLean
I didn't go to the boat today. It's the first one on C dock. Also feel free to text or call me. I don't get emails on my bronze age phone. My # is on a previous PM.

Yes that north channel can be tricky. I learned to read it carefully. Thankfully just mush- no rocks. I mushed aground in the same place as you. At high tide, though, I have sailed right through the middle of the opening of the bay between the north and south channels.

And- I went to grad school at the Darden school and my son has just finished a BFA from there (yaaa).
What department, Jay?
 
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