Mast Rainwater!
- Thread starter Christian Williams
- Start date
Same thing this week
Christian,
I was on the Wind Chaser this week and watched a ribbon of water run down the pretty silver mast insert from the coach roof to the base of the mast and into the bilge. Funny the things you notice when the rain is outside washing away the drought.
Best,
Christian,
I was on the Wind Chaser this week and watched a ribbon of water run down the pretty silver mast insert from the coach roof to the base of the mast and into the bilge. Funny the things you notice when the rain is outside washing away the drought.
Best,
Caught in the act!!!!
I'm surprised by the large volume of water dripping from the co-ax rather than from the drain slot at the mast step. Bgary pointed out in another thread that there is another set of wires (mast lighting) that exits the mast between the cabin surface and the cabin headliner. Depending on the lay of these wires, there could be considerable leakage in this area, too.
About half the Ericson's I looked at before buying Mariah had stained or rotted teak around the windows/ports. It's always difficult to detect the source of leaks, but I started to assume that water damage below the ports was likely from leaking port seals and that damage above the ports was likely from water running along the inside of the headliner (either from the mast wiring or from leaky deck fittings).
I'm surprised by the large volume of water dripping from the co-ax rather than from the drain slot at the mast step. Bgary pointed out in another thread that there is another set of wires (mast lighting) that exits the mast between the cabin surface and the cabin headliner. Depending on the lay of these wires, there could be considerable leakage in this area, too.
About half the Ericson's I looked at before buying Mariah had stained or rotted teak around the windows/ports. It's always difficult to detect the source of leaks, but I started to assume that water damage below the ports was likely from leaking port seals and that damage above the ports was likely from water running along the inside of the headliner (either from the mast wiring or from leaky deck fittings).
u079721
Contributing Partner
Maybe we were lucky, but when I did these three things we never had any trouble with the rainwater getting anywhere other than the bilge.
1) Filled the mast track with silicone inside the mast boot, and made sure the boot was working
2) Put a generous drip loop in the mast wires inside the mast just before they exited the side of the mast to enter the headliner
3) Drilled extra weep holes in the mast support plate just inside the inner perimeter of the mast
Still had lots of rainwater, but it never pooled on the cabin sole or rotted out the wood.
1) Filled the mast track with silicone inside the mast boot, and made sure the boot was working
2) Put a generous drip loop in the mast wires inside the mast just before they exited the side of the mast to enter the headliner
3) Drilled extra weep holes in the mast support plate just inside the inner perimeter of the mast
Still had lots of rainwater, but it never pooled on the cabin sole or rotted out the wood.
If anyone has ideas on how to reduce or eliminate this I would love to hear. On our 38-200 we get a lot of rain/snow melt in the winter and since it freezes it always worries me that there might be so much volume that I get an overflow. I often end up melting some mid winter to keep things in check.
I'm halfway thinking I should start a "rain log".
Checked on the boat yesterday after several storms came through, and found over 3" of water in the bilge (probably 7-8 gallons)
Having a really hard time believing that much water is coming down through the rig, but... I suppose, over the course of several very wet days, it's possible.
Bilge stayed nice and dry last summer (*) , so I don't think it is coming up through keel-bolts and there's no sign of water around any of the thru-hulls, not sure where else it could be coming from but... it has my attention.
(*) except when out sailing. Water seems to come out of dark and scary places under the TAFG when the boat heels. No idea how to get (and keep) those places dry...
Checked on the boat yesterday after several storms came through, and found over 3" of water in the bilge (probably 7-8 gallons)
Having a really hard time believing that much water is coming down through the rig, but... I suppose, over the course of several very wet days, it's possible.
Bilge stayed nice and dry last summer (*) , so I don't think it is coming up through keel-bolts and there's no sign of water around any of the thru-hulls, not sure where else it could be coming from but... it has my attention.
(*) except when out sailing. Water seems to come out of dark and scary places under the TAFG when the boat heels. No idea how to get (and keep) those places dry...
Alan Gomes
Sustaining Partner
Do you have a way of knowing whether that 3" of water in the bilge is after the bilge pump may have cycled a time or two (or several)?
A few years back I had a leak that turned out to be a void in the layup where the fiberglass rudder tube was bonded to the hull. In the course of trouble shooting it (and out of curiosity) I added a bilge pump cycle counter so I could track what was happening with that leak. The counter shows the number of times the bilge pump cycles in the last 24 hours, the last week, and within the last two weeks. It was interesting to note from the counter that some weeks the pump would not cycle at all and then other weeks it would cycle several times. It was very weird trying to figure out what was causing this mystery leak to come and go. Turns out that the small void we eventually discovered would get plugged with bottom growth and seal itself up. Right after a bottom cleaning it would again expose the leak and I'd get a slow trickle of water into the bilge.
rain problem and a "fowl" answer
Rain has set a record here in the Portland area for February. After a day of 1/2" to 1" of rainfall, I usually find near to or over a gallon in the bilge. A double spreader rig with four halyards has a lot of places for rain water to enter.
I use the "special dewatering device" (a 1.99 turkey baster) every time I visit.
Loren
Rain has set a record here in the Portland area for February. After a day of 1/2" to 1" of rainfall, I usually find near to or over a gallon in the bilge. A double spreader rig with four halyards has a lot of places for rain water to enter.
I use the "special dewatering device" (a 1.99 turkey baster) every time I visit.
Loren
It's a good question, and one that occurred to me several bilge-fulls ago.
My main bilge pump sits on top of a pair of keel bolts, so the bottom of the pump is about 2-1/2" up from the bottom of the sump, and it takes 3-1/2" or so of water to activate it. I put the bilge pump up on a temporary riser (a small plastic spool) so now the bottom is about 4" up - still well within the bilge, but.. higher.
With 3" or so of water in the bilge, I "know" that it hasn't triggered a pump cycle, because the water level is well clear of the bottom of the pump. Low-tech way of knowing that what I see is (apparently) what I've gotten.
Edited to add: the geek in me has thought about getting some salinity (or PH?) test strips so I can tell whether the water is fresh, salt, or mix. Presumably, "fresh" would imply rainwater, "salt" would mean I have something else going on. But... not sure I feel that nerdy at this point.... mostly just itching for spring.
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Yeah, records around here, too.
Haven't seen stats for Everett, but last I saw Seattle was running close to 9" in February, something over 13" since the first of the year and 33" since October. All well above "normal".
Alan Gomes
Sustaining Partner
Or, go low-tech and just use the tip of your tongue. :nerd: I've used that method to detect a FW leak from a weeping fitting on my water tank and it's pretty easy to tell the difference. I guess if it were a mixture of salt and fresh it might be a bit more tricky, but if you think it's from rain water it may be obvious. Of course, if there's a chance it is sewage I'd probably opt for another method :0 (though your nose might tell you what you need to know anyway).
Tom Metzger
Sustaining Partner
bgary - Not long after I bought Xanthus I replaced the cabin sole because of delamination. I decided that the cause of the problem, beyond the lack of sealing of the plywood, was water caught in the TAFG segments. The limber holes are up about 3/4" above the hull so water collects. On an E-34 the problems are in front of the head and by the starboard water tank next to the settee. To remedy this I glassed in a 3/4" board so the water would be at the level of the limber hole and would drain. The first one I filled with leftover T&H plywood (one can only make so many spice racks) and then I used construction foam for the others. Sixteen years later no problem so it may have helped.
Yeah.....no. having seen the water that comes out from under the TAFG when the boat has been sailed, I'm not letting my tongue anywhere near. Who knows what's been growing under there for the last 30+ years?
As a random aside... it has occurred to me that I could run some solution (maybe a combination of bilge-cleaner, Dawn and biodegradeable disinfectant) through the TAFG - fill it up, pump it out, repeat a few times. It might "freshen up" some places under the grid that I can't get to with a sponge.
...but that seems pretty anal, even for me.
_/)_
So I understand... basically what that does is make it so the bottom surface of the "bilge pocket" is at the same level as the bottom of the limber hole?
If that's right... I'm not sure I understand how that helps. There might still be water trapped inside the TAFG, below the level of the bottom surface of the bilge pocket, even if the bilge pocket itself is dry....?
I've actually thought about going the other direction, opening up the limber hole so that it is closer to the bottom of the bilge pocket, so I can get more of that "trapped" water out. But haven't thought that through to any degree...
Tom Metzger
Sustaining Partner
I wasn't concerned about water under the grid. My only concern was preserving the sole.
Hey... do I sound like a preacher?
My recollection is that the grid drains to the bilge on the E-34. I'm not sure that water is trapped under it. My pix from that time aren't very good at showing the limber holes on the bilge side, but I think they back me up.
Hey... do I sound like a preacher?
My recollection is that the grid drains to the bilge on the E-34. I'm not sure that water is trapped under it. My pix from that time aren't very good at showing the limber holes on the bilge side, but I think they back me up.
Just pumped out 2.5 gal from the bilge with a hand pump last night. That’s the amount that accumulated over the 14 days since I last checked on the boat. It’s rained the last 14 days straight in Gig Harbor, though pretty lightly most days.
Seems like I’ve pulled out up to 3-4 gal out at other times, over shorter periods of time. It’s hard to correlate the bilge level with rainfall. Wind is probably a factor too, driving water into all the little openings in the mast.
A brief (and maybe even interesting) update.
A week or so ago I put a wood bung in the limber hole in the bottom of the bilge pocket just behind the mast step. That effectively isolated it from the other bilge pockets and the area under the TAFG.
Went down to the boat today to find nearly 6" of very clear water in that pocket... about 1.5 gallons... and virtually no water elsewhere in the bilge.
So, maybe that *is* all rainwater that is coming down thru the mast.
Kind of surprising.
A week or so ago I put a wood bung in the limber hole in the bottom of the bilge pocket just behind the mast step. That effectively isolated it from the other bilge pockets and the area under the TAFG.
Went down to the boat today to find nearly 6" of very clear water in that pocket... about 1.5 gallons... and virtually no water elsewhere in the bilge.
So, maybe that *is* all rainwater that is coming down thru the mast.
Kind of surprising.
David Grimm
E38-200
Rain Water
Christian, As you are aware it rains here in NY more then it is sunny in LA! Did you ever figure out a way to keep the mast rainwater on deck and out of the bilge? Just put my Ericson 38 on the dry for the winter and got hit with a huge rain storm. 5 inches! The bilge pump gets most of it out. I plan on putting a solar charger on the shrink wrap to keep the batteries up. Upon inspection I did notice that someone drilled a small hole in the mast plate to let the water drain out into the bilge thus keeping it away from the cabin sole.
Dave
Christian, As you are aware it rains here in NY more then it is sunny in LA! Did you ever figure out a way to keep the mast rainwater on deck and out of the bilge? Just put my Ericson 38 on the dry for the winter and got hit with a huge rain storm. 5 inches! The bilge pump gets most of it out. I plan on putting a solar charger on the shrink wrap to keep the batteries up. Upon inspection I did notice that someone drilled a small hole in the mast plate to let the water drain out into the bilge thus keeping it away from the cabin sole.
Dave
GrandpaSteve
Sustaining Member
The owners manual does say to expect that.