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1986 35-3 Fuel Tank Quarter Berth water leak

dsdemarest

Member I
On my boat, a small amount of water accumulates at the low point closest to the engine and immediately forward of the fuel tank in a low point. I have removed the quarter berth platform, exposing the tank and all surrounding areas. There is no sign the water is moving forward along the tank or entering from above and migrating from the hull in the area of the dorade vent just aft of the electrical panels to the low point where it collects. Areas under the deck hardware - winches, stanchions - appear dry, and I rebedded the dorade vent thinking it was suspect.

It has been suggested that the moisture is coming from condensation around the fuel tank. The weather this past week has put that thought to rest - it is clear there is water coming from somewhere. Here are a couple of pictures:

IMG_1610.jpg

IMG_1611.jpg

(Sorry the rotation on the photos is off...)

As mentioned, the only water around the tank is at the low spot viewed via the cut-out in the area above the stained cabin sole.

Any ideas would be appreciated.
 
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Cory B

Sustaining Member
Limber hole?

I can't help you with the source of the water, however, on our boat we had a similar issue, including the same discoloring of the floor. In our case, the problem was the Ericson factory had neglected to drill out a limber hole in the triaxial grid under the floor alongside the nav table, which allowed the mystery water to collect. I had cut an access hole in the floor, and then drill a limber hole myself.
 

Frank Langer

1984 Ericson 30+, Nanaimo, BC
On our boat I once noticed periodic water droplets on the rudder tube which then accumulated below the fuel tank and engine. Tightening the rudder stuffing box fixed that. I wonder if your water is coming from a similar location.
Frank
 

dsdemarest

Member I
On our boat I once noticed periodic water droplets on the rudder tube which then accumulated below the fuel tank and engine. Tightening the rudder stuffing box fixed that. I wonder if your water is coming from a similar location.
Frank

Thanks for the idea. I will look at that, but do find it hard to imagine how it would migrate up to the side to get under the fuel tank, given the area under the engine is lower. But I will check. Thanks again.
 

dsdemarest

Member I
Limber holes

I can't help you with the source of the water, however, on our boat we had a similar issue, including the same discoloring of the floor. In our case, the problem was the Ericson factory had neglected to drill out a limber hole in the triaxial grid under the floor alongside the nav table, which allowed the mystery water to collect. I had cut an access hole in the floor, and then drill a limber hole myself.

When you drilled the limber hole did you find any wood or foam in the triaxial grid? And was it necessary to drill all the way through or would the water have drained through the raised part of the grid down to the centerline and then forward to the bilge? Thanks.
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Check the shaft stuffing box. It may be throwing water.

Check the rudder tube gland, if may leak only at full power speeds.

I don't see how such water could escape the TAFG molding which isolates the engine, but maybe it can.

Check for a fresh water system leak that might migrate there.

As mentioned, water may be trapped in a TAFG tabbing pocket right under that area of the sole. It can travel across the top of the TAFG, under the sole, if the pocket is anywhere near full and the boat heels over.

Unfortunately, checking that pocket means removing the floorboards in that area, or cutting a hole.

I had quite a mess from full tabbing pockets caused by a long-time fresh plumbing leak:

http://www.ericsonyachts.org/infoex...I-quot-Delaminated-floorboards-4-minute-video
 

dsdemarest

Member I
Check the shaft stuffing box. It may be throwing water.

Check the rudder tube gland, if may leak only at full power speeds.

I don't see how such water could escape the TAFG molding which isolates the engine, but maybe it can.

Check for a fresh water system leak that might migrate there.

As mentioned, water may be trapped in a TAFG tabbing pocket right under that area of the sole. It can travel across the top of the TAFG, under the sole, if the pocket is anywhere near full and the boat heels over.

Unfortunately, checking that pocket means removing the floorboards in that area, or cutting a hole.

I had quite a mess from full tabbing pockets caused by a long-time fresh plumbing leak:

http://www.ericsonyachts.org/infoex...I-quot-Delaminated-floorboards-4-minute-video

Christian:

Thanks for your comments.

It is clear the presence of the water is not dependent upon being underway, and I agree it would be very difficult if not impossible to get from the engine area to the fuel tank area, as there is a raised portion of the TAFG running front to back that separates the two areas. Nor is there any fresh water plumbing running through the area.

Clearly the water is in the fuel tank area, which is aft of the TAFG cross section. The damage on the sole is from water exposure from the tank area. Don't believe it is from underneath the sole.

More than a couple of people have suggested the water is coming from fuel tank condensation. Any thoughts on that?

And the the thought of drilling a drain hole into the TAFG, figuring the water would migrate through and to the bilge crossed my mind.

Appreciate your thoughts. And nice job on your sole repair with the de-lamination!

David
 

supersailor

Contributing Partner
First, the taste test. Is the water salt or fresh? If salt, look to the shaft log or rudder shaft log or at salt water hoses. If fresh, look at any pressurized hoses nearby (water heater), then any deck leaks (ports, through hull fittings, hull/deck joint). A tarp placed over the affected area will eliminate that source.

Is there any water showing up in the bilge? This seems too much for condensation. Try an electric dehumidifier which should eliminate any condensation problem. Get an instrument for reading the humidity. If over about 70%, humidity could be a factor. Terra Nova is currently reading 59% in the cabin. Does the water build up when the boat is at the dock? Under sail, water goes everywhere.

A mechanics mirror on a wand along with a powerful light is a great way to trace rivulets in tight areas.

My experience with water is it rarely comes from where you expect it. :0
 

dsdemarest

Member I
First, the taste test. Is the water salt or fresh? If salt, look to the shaft log or rudder shaft log or at salt water hoses. If fresh, look at any pressurized hoses nearby (water heater), then any deck leaks (ports, through hull fittings, hull/deck joint). A tarp placed over the affected area will eliminate that source.

Is there any water showing up in the bilge? This seems too much for condensation. Try an electric dehumidifier which should eliminate any condensation problem. Get an instrument for reading the humidity. If over about 70%, humidity could be a factor. Terra Nova is currently reading 59% in the cabin. Does the water build up when the boat is at the dock? Under sail, water goes everywhere.

A mechanics mirror on a wand along with a powerful light is a great way to trace rivulets in tight areas.

My experience with water is it rarely comes from where you expect it. :0


The water is fresh!

There are no pressurized hoses in the area, and for what it is worth, water pump is generally off. I have accessed the underside of all deck hardware in the area and all is dry. The port dorade vent was suspect, so I did rebed that.

I have water in the bilge, as my mast is stepped at the bilge and has internal halyards. In other words, the bilge does not stay dry!

The water does build up at the dock. I can dry the area and will shortly see some weeping coming back in (appearing from under the leading edge of the fuel tank), and if we have a heavy rain the area will definitely be wet.

It is interesting, as the fuel tank effectively sits in its own area of the TAFG and associated molded shell. Pretty well self contained from water getting in from anywhere else other than above. And that has been eliminated.

I will be getting a dehumidifier.

Appreciate your thoughts.

David
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
I rotated the photos after confirming orientation on my desktop.

One other long shot: a leaking sliding hatch, testable with a hose. But that would leave a pool of water on the sole, if the affected area is the low point.

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supersailor

Contributing Partner
David,

This appears to be in the area of the jib sheet winch and tracks. It would be a good idea to take a moisture meter and check the deck for saturation in these areas. If the core has moisture, it is a clue to what might be leaking. I also would put a tarp over the area to stop penetration during heavy rains. The deck appears to be suspect. Do you have zippers in your headliner so you can check the penetrations for moisture?

Bob
 
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adam

Member III
Both of my Ericsons so far had leaky hull deck joints.

I don't know specifically about the 35-3, but it might be worth removing the rub rail, inspecting, and resealing.
 

dsdemarest

Member I
David,

This appears to be in the area of the jib sheet winch and tracks. It would be a good idea to take a moisture meter and check the deck for saturation in these areas. If the core has moisture, it is a clue to what might be leaking. I also would put a tarp over the area to stop penetration during heavy rains. The deck appears to be suspect. Do you have zippers in your headliner so you can check the penetrations for moisture?

Bob

Bob:

I do have zippers and there is no moisture (visible or to the touch) under the hardware. And the outer edge forward and aft near the hull/deck joint is dry. And even if it water was migrating down the inside of the hull, behind the vinyl finish, it would continue under the molded TAFG unit rather than showing up inside by the fuel tank. Unless, I suppose the molded TAFG unit is not intact under the tank.

Thanks - getting some great suggestions!

David
 

Loren Beach

O34 - Portland, OR
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Long shot, but have you checked the fuel fill deck fitting to make sure it is sealed and rain cannot migrate around it and get inside the boat?
How about any other deck penetrations in that quadrant of the boat?
 

dsdemarest

Member I
Long shot, but have you checked the fuel fill deck fitting to make sure it is sealed and rain cannot migrate around it and get inside the boat?
How about any other deck penetrations in that quadrant of the boat?

Looked at that. It is aft of where the molded TAFG pan starts at the aft bulkhead, and the fuel hose where it enters the compartment is dry. Have also looked at other penetrations.

Thanks!
 

mkollerjr

Member III
Blogs Author
I always had water accumulate there on my 38. It was a low spot with no drainage, and fresh water would just accumulate after a while. My guess was it was condensation. There did not appear to be an easy way to permanently route it to the bilge, so I’d just sponge it out every now and then. It never got to to the point of causing floorboard damage though.
 
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