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30+ Scupper Drain Rerouting Advice

bigd14

Contributing Partner
Blogs Author
With a new boat comes lots of questions. Has anyone rerouted the 30+ cockpit drains from the recesses of the bilge to the transom? The original design is a little sketchy. For one thing, the thru hulls must be open all the time, which I don't care for at all. Also, the port cockpit scupper shares a thru hull with the sink drain and can only be reached by lying on your stomach on the sole doing a Superman. This is not conducive to cycling the valve handle, let alone actually performing any maintenance. And finally, if the thru hull gets plugged or left closed by accident, the sink will fill up if it rains or the cockpit gets water in it.

Is there enough of a height difference so a following sea doesn't come into the cockpit?

Since there are already 4 thru hulls in the transom, would it be OK to double up on the two current bilge pump exits? I would have to put a loop in the bilge pump hoses of course.

Or should I route them to new thru hulls just under the counter, where the propane vent thru hull is in the second photo?

Thanks.

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bigd14

Contributing Partner
Blogs Author
Let me rephrase my question :).

Can anyone tell me how their aft cockpit scuppers drain in other Ericson models?

Thanks!
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
It wasn't uncommon for Ericson to share through-hulls. On my era E38, separate shower sump and main bilge lines meet at a T-fitting on a single exit.

On the 32-3, the forward cockpit drains Are "T"'d at a single through-hull.

Cockpit drains are often crossed to prevent seawater drawn into the cockpit from the leeward drain when heeled. It doesn't always work, and can be awkward to install, so some just let the hoses take the straightest route overboard and put up with occasional wet feet.

Access is bad for many through-hulls. You'll have to face the philosophical question of what they're there for, the arguments for closing them or leaving them open, and why we were all put here on the earth in the first place.
 

toddster

Curator of Broken Parts
Blogs Author
My E29 has only a single cockpit drain, which bothers me a bit. It's a very short hose - maybe six inches - that goes directly from the bottom of a sump at the aft end to a downward-pointing through-hull beneath the transom, infinitesimally above the water line. With a little S-curve in between the two. The hose is totally inaccessible. Though I have since installed a deck-plate in the liner side of the transom to gain access to hardware, so maybe I should make another attempt on that hose.

One thing on my to-do list is to install at least one more drain. It ought to be fairly easy to put one at the forward end of the cockpit and tee into the galley drain. But then this would lead to discovery of the condition of the core in the sole, of which I am happily ignorant, and might open up another can of worms. Oh - good point on draining to the sink - that drain would itself need another valve - or the sink drain would. Maybe there's room for one more hose to the transom.

Then, if we are worrying about getting pooped, we need to start worrying about the exhaust riser and the fuel tank vent... The weather is too nice to worry today.
 
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Frank Langer

1984 Ericson 30+, Nanaimo, BC
Bigd14,
I have a1984 E30+ and have thought alot about this. My setup is like yours, the starboard cockpit scupper draining through a thruhull accessible in the quarterberth, the port scupper draining through a thruhull shared with the galley sink. If the thru hulls are bronze and sound, the hoses are thick and not brittle, the sink drain is well constructed with metal, not plastic fittings, and if everything is double clamped, I think it's ok. I leave both scupper thru hulls open to drain the cockpit if it rains, and I open/close them once a month to keep them moving well, and lubricate at haulout. I've never had water enter the cockpit from either scupper while sailing, despite heeling and significant waves.
Yes, they are a bit awkward to get to, but not a big deal.
I think there are more important things in life to think about. :)
Frank
 
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Shelman

Member III
Blogs Author
My cockpit drains exit through the transom. They are above waterline at the dock but well under while motiring. In my experience if the cockpit sole is above waterline it doesnt matter where the drains exit. If the cockpit sole is below waterline the sea will flow in and if the sole is above sea level then water will drain out. In my case they don't have to criss cross or any noncence, and a following sea has no ill affect on them.
I also have two bilge pumps sharing one transom through hull exit. One is the whale diaphram pump which by its nature prevents water from the other pump from backflowing through it. And the other pump on the line is a very high flow centrifugal pump that has an anti siphion loop that goes all the way up to the highest point on the underside of the cockpit coaming which prevents water from the My cockpit drains exit through the transom. They are above waterline at the dock but well under while motiring. In my experience if the cockpit sole is above waterline it doesnt matter where the drains exit. If the cockpit sole is below waterline the sea will flow in and if the sole is above sea level then water will drain out. In my case they don't have to criss cross or any noncence, and a following sea has no ill affect on them.
 
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Glyn Judson

Moderator
Moderator
How do our scuppers drain?

Dear friend, Our three cockpit scuppers came from the factory draining as follows. The starboard one led to a 1 1/4" seacock the center aft one combined with it. The port scupper hose T-ed with the galley sink added to the chaos below deck in the engine room. I added a port seacock and increased both to 1 1/2", still combining the aft and starboard ones but giving the port one its own and doing away with the T-fittting at the galley. Furthermore, I changed the scuppers themselves to Perko brand with floating balls designed to prevent water from backing up in the cockpit (thanks to David of E31 Emerald for the inspiration for this). They work as designed. Here are a few photos of my installation. Glyn Judson, E31 hull #55, Marina del Rey CA
 

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Glyn Judson

Moderator
Moderator
Perco scuppers.

I forgot to add that these 1 1/2" Perko scuppers cost small fortune each. I think I got all three in the same visit to my local consignment chandler, Minney's, for the princely sum of $15.00 per. I replaced the floating balls with new ones, easily accessed by removing the threaded grate, photo attached. So for anyone contemplating doing the same, go down your list of consignment chandlers in Canada or the US, a list that can be found on line at the Good Old Boat Magazine web site. I mechanically removed the chrome on only what shows using my vintage 48" Craftsman belt sander. I think they came out looking alright. Hope this helps, Glyn Judson, E31 hull #55, Marina del Rey CA
 

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bigd14

Contributing Partner
Blogs Author
Thanks for all the great replies. Until now I wasn't aware that thoughts of thru hulls could lead to an existential crisis!

Shelman I like your idea for plumbing the bilge pump through the manual pump. I will have to look at that. Would save a lot of hose and space.

I could then use the spare thru hull in the transom (enlarged of course) to plumb the two cockpit drains. And Glyn I like the ball valve scupper idea (I may keep the chrome though:)).

Or I could listen to the voice of reason (thank you Frank) and just leave it as it is. It didn't sink* for the last 31 years so I should be able to match that.


*Both cockpit drain thru hulls were leaking when I got the boat. The Marelon valves were frozen open and could not be fully closed. And in trying to cycle them I made the poorly fitting plastic ball valve-to-hose connectors leak much faster and could not get them to stop until the boat was hauled out!

Toddster, my E27 had the same setup you describe, which leaked anytime the stern squatted under power. I glassed in a G10 pipe and never looked back. I think I still have some of that pipe somewhere if you are interested in doing that mod. Let me know.
 
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Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
>>>>The Marelon valves were frozen open and could not be fully closed. And in trying to cycle them I made the poorly fitting plastic ball valve-to-hose connectors leak much faster and could not get them to stop until tte boat was hauled out!

Yikes!

Reminds me to cycle the Marelon more frequently.
 

Glyn Judson

Moderator
Moderator
Bronze vs. chrome.

Dear friend, The only reason I removed the chrome on mine is that the majority of hardware on our boat is bronze and it was more in keeping to follow that look with the new-to-me scuppers. FYI, the 1 1/2" version can go for as much as a bit south of $200 on eBay. I stumbled into this one at $75.00 that might be of interest to you or others: 322088858850. Simply plug that number into the eBay search box and it'll pop up. good luck, Glyn
 

Jenkins

Member II
scupper drain hoses - what to use?

boat currently has the ribbed hoses with the plastic collars on the end that sort of look like either sanitation system hoses or swiming pool filter hoses.

mine apear to be quite old and are on my need to replace list.

sugestions for options welome.

thanks,

peter

PS - I have an e29 with wheel steering so the cockpit is split in two. each cockpit has two drains and they are plumbed criss cross to thruhulls that are below the waterine. one of the thruhulls also hasthe galley sink teed in. Has anybody ever modified his set up to transom drains? I would repfer to be able to close all thruhulls when i leave the boat but the onetime i did this the galley sink got a little disgusting...
 

Shelman

Member III
Blogs Author
Yes replace the hoses for sure. I used nylon reinforced radiator hose, its super tough but still flexable. I absolutly hate the white sanitation hose because it always self destructs when I have to remove it making it single use.
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bigd14

Contributing Partner
Blogs Author
Final Solution

After much hemming and hawing and looking at other boats and photos, I decided to relocate the cockpit drains to the counter, and use the Groco scupper drains with the ball to prevent any backflow. The thru-hulls will likely end up under water when sailing, so I may eventually cross the hoses if it becomes a problem but I am going to try it this way for now.


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bigd14

Contributing Partner
Blogs Author
Update: While I have not sailed in any really heavy weather there has not been a singly drop of water coming in through the scuppers in any of the normal conditions I have encountered. They do drain more slowly than the originals and can get clogged with bird nest remnants etc. But now I can close the sink drain thru hull. I did not install seacocks on the scupper hoses since they are above the waterline when the boat is docked. The thru hulls are Marelon and the hose is wire-reinforced heavy duty exhaust hose, all double clamped. I may eventually add seacocks but for now make do with regular system checks.
 
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