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E35-II measurements for best waterline

Leander

Member II
I am owner #6 or 7 of hull #228 (1972) Ericson 35-II. I am still getting to know her sailing characteristics. I am at a point of making improvements, one of which is to re-do the tankage: water, waste, fuel. I have to decide on both size and location of the tanks. Status when I bought the boat was: Metal water tank centerline bow, perhaps original, capacity unknown. Poly fuel tank, 25 gallons, centerline under cockpit, and waste holding tank, 9 gallons, under bow cabin bunk, starboard.

I have read a number of discussions re: avoiding "hobby-horse" effect with too much weight forward, value of putting holding tank high above waterline, etc. A lot of information for a newcomer to try to put into a coherent whole.

I know that I can start experimenting, and see what performance is like, but this seems like a costly approach in both time and money if any of you already know the answer.

I have tried searching the forums before posting, without success.

I would like to start by simply balancing the boat fore-and aft the way the designer Bruce King intended. After 43 years and 7 owners, I have no reason to trust the current boot stripe as an intended waterline. Does anyone have these simple specifications: vertical distance from bow to waterline and from transom to waterline in a boat with average load? My intended use is daysailing in and outside San Diego Bay, occasional beer can races, occasional sail to Catalina or Mexico.

Thanks for any help!
Leander
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
I would think that the original configurations would give the original balance, which shouldn't have changed. Maybe subsequent owners added tankage, batteries, gear?

On my boat 32-3, with its fine entry, tolerance is low for weight forward, and so I keep the optional bow water tank empty, and don't load up the chain locker.

A consideration for trim is also crew (Seven people in the cockpit trumps the trim effect of any holding tank). In general, we're supposed to keep weight out of the ends of the boat.

Is there some evidence that she is out of trim?
 

Leander

Member II
The designed waterline for this boat is 4.92' , from the bottom of the keel. If the boat is out of the water and level you can use the water filled clear tubing method to determine the waterline around the hull or a laser level.

I may just be too green to understand. My problem is that when I have had my boat out of the water, I am unable to tell whether the boat is level. I do not understand what reference point or reference plane is used. Is there some particular part of the boat that is designed to be perfectly horizontal, perfectly vertical, or at any other defined angle that I can use as a reference? The bottom of the keel? A countertop in the galley? When I look at a boat, in the water or out of the water, all I see is graceful curves everywhere.

I do understand the water tubing method, and have used it to paint a bootstripe, but I had no idea whether the boat was level when I did it. I'm stuck at the earlier step of getting the boat level.

Thanks,
Leander
 

Leander

Member II
Lines plan for Ericson 35-II?

I would think that the original configurations would give the original balance, which shouldn't have changed. Maybe subsequent owners added tankage, batteries, gear?

On my boat 32-3, with its fine entry, tolerance is low for weight forward, and so I keep the optional bow water tank empty, and don't load up the chain locker.

A consideration for trim is also crew (Seven people in the cockpit trumps the trim effect of any holding tank). In general, we're supposed to keep weight out of the ends of the boat.

Is there some evidence that she is out of trim?

The only evidence I have she is out of trim is that my bootstripe is more out of the water at the bow.

I do not have any information on "original configuration."

I have thought of a completely different way to ask my question. Does anyone have a lines plan for the Ericson 35-2? There may be one right here on the Ericson site, but I do not think I have ever seen it. The only lines drawing I have seen is a single side view in advertising and review copy which seems to have a waterline drawn on it. I suppose I could eyeball from that drawing, have the top of the rudder near the water surface, and have a vertical from the bow chain locker bulkhead drop down to touch the water at the bow.

Or I could just forget about it and go sailing, which I guess is what everyone else is doing!

Thanks,
Leander
 

Shelman

Member III
Blogs Author
The only thing "level" on my little E-26 is the bottom of the keel... so if it is setting on level ground, or trailer in my instance then I think the boat can be considered level.
My cockpit is close but not quite (the cockpit sole slopes aft and drains the cockpit well but the bench tops actually slope slightly forward always catching a few ounces of water when it rains. The deck of course slopes upward in a curve. I have never checked any of the interior items like the counter or settees but would not trust them to check level.
 

Leander

Member II
There are two axes that you are dealing with, port to starboard and bow to stern. You could use the tube method to level port to starboard. If you were to use the identical location at the gunnels for the tubes, you could level the boat port to starboard. You could just set up the tubes at midships to reference the water level off the gunnels, however additional set ups forward and aft of midships would probably help make leveling in this direction more accurate. Another choice is to use a level to span port to starboard across the midships hatch or companionway hatch slides. These features are designed to be symmetrical by their very nature. For the fore and aft leveling, I think you may find that the most level item will be the cabin sole midships. You could try a level fore and aft there or even try using a round bubble level. If you look at the drawings I have attached for the E32, you will see that the cabin sole seems to be parallel to the waterline. Also, you can notice that the waterline seems to intersect at the aft end of the rudder post, leaving a small portion of your rudder out of the water, so this should give you some information as to where fore and aft trim should be.As far as the counters benches being put in level, it would seem to me that they were put in as such. This would be just basic craftsmanship and there locations and dimensions would be called out as part of the manufacturing plan.



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I like your thoughts here, fullandby, on the leveling idea. It makes sense that the sole would be level.

This is not a high immediate priority for me, but next time I am hauled out to paint, I think I will spend some time trying to level the sole. I see two other helpful clues, both on this website. In the Downloads section, ericson 35-2, there is a "color brochure that seems to suggest that the floor of the cockpit is parallel with the waterline. Also, the rig tuning specifications suggest that the mast should be vertical, with no rake.

If I learn any more, I will be sure to post a followup.

Thanks all for the ideas!

Leander
 

Leander

Member II
"Level" clues

The only thing "level" on my little E-26 is the bottom of the keel... so if it is setting on level ground, or trailer in my instance then I think the boat can be considered level.
My cockpit is close but not quite (the cockpit sole slopes aft and drains the cockpit well but the bench tops actually slope slightly forward always catching a few ounces of water when it rains. The deck of course slopes upward in a curve. I have never checked any of the interior items like the counter or settees but would not trust them to check level.

Hi,

From the entry by fullandby, you can see that the keel bottom on the 35-2 slopes upward somewhat as it moves forward, so unfortunately this would not be a good reference palne for the 35-2, I don't think. Thanks for the idea anyway.

Leander
 

Leander

Member II
Not sure if an edit will trigger an alert to people following this so just in case I wanted to bring to their attention that I did an edit on my previous post here due to an error. Ooops!

As far as the cockpit being level, that may be, at least judging from the drawing, but it wouldn't be unusual for there to be some slope on this to help with drainage. Hell, just take three levels, put one on the sole, one on the forepeak bunk, and one on the cockpit sole. If you can get all of them to agree to level, well then I would think that would be pretty much mean you were level. Just keep on the center line of the boat.

Good points, and thank you for your thoughts. I would think you might be right about cockpit drainage.
 

Loren Beach

O34 - Portland, OR
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Leveling thoughts

Studying the drawings for most boats, I would guess that the NA planned for people to sit/sleep on the level, when the boat is floating on its lines.
The cockpit sole will have a degree or three of slope toward a drain point.
I can visualize a scenario where I can level my boat on land and have it stay that way, but not afloat.
One the hard, I can adjust the jacks one at a time while putting a spirit level on on the molded-in waterline stripe.

If the stripe is much-painted-over through the decades and suspect......next I would have to put the level on the inside flat surfaces, like settees and forepeak and keep going in and out and slowly adjusting the big screws on props until the spirit levels all agreed. Hopefully they would agree. :rolleyes:

In the last decade, laser levels have come down in cost, making it much faster to do final taping once the location of the WL stripe is chosen. This does not bypass the tedious step of "leveling" the hull, however.

Opinions rendered on the hour, deposit $.02.
:)

Loren
 

Leander

Member II
What parts are level?

Studying the drawings for most boats, I would guess that the NA planned for people to sit/sleep on the level, when the boat is floating on its lines.
The cockpit sole will have a degree or three of slope toward a drain point.
I can visualize a scenario where I can level my boat on land and have it stay that way, but not afloat.
One the hard, I can adjust the jacks one at a time while putting a spirit level on on the molded-in waterline stripe.

If the stripe is much-painted-over through the decades and suspect......next I would have to put the level on the inside flat surfaces, like settees and forepeak and keep going in and out and slowly adjusting the big screws on props until the spirit levels all agreed. Hopefully they would agree. :rolleyes:

In the last decade, laser levels have come down in cost, making it much faster to do final taping once the location of the WL stripe is chosen. This does not bypass the tedious step of "leveling" the hull, however.

Opinions rendered on the hour, deposit $.02.
:)

Loren

This sounds like a good idea in general, and probably one I will do. I do have the impression that when it comes to boat design, nothing is absolute. For example Fred P. Bingham (Boat Joinery and Cabinetmaking Simplified, International Marine 1993, p. 177), describes intentionally designing foot of bunk 1.5" higher than head to gain more width to the bunk on one of his designs. I could imagine similar compromises being made everywhere else. In the big picture, however, getting the fore-aft balance within 1-2 inches, or even a little more, would be just fine. I would probably go with the cabin dining table as the surface most likely to have been designed horizontally level, and go from there.

Thanks for the ideas!

Leander
 

Christian Williams

E381 - Los Angeles
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
You guys are way more complicated than me (am). To I, level is what looks level.

If my paint waterline were wrong (submerged, uneven, wavy), I would observe the boat sitting in the water looking good, then mark the hull there.

I 'd bring the new bottom paint up three or even four full inches above that line, leave an inch or so of white gel coat, and add the decorative boot top stripe.

Many smaller cruisers, when weighed down with junk and people for a cruise, are down on their lines. I get growth on the boot top, and wish I had the margin of bottom paint to handle it.
 

toddster

Curator of Broken Parts
Blogs Author
After fitting a few pieces of cabinetry to my boat, I find it apparent that no part of it is square or level and very few parts are straight. Boatbuilders minds must be fundamentally different from carpenters. :rolleyes:
However, re the boot stripe, I believe that mine is not just "painted on." The gel coat is actually a different color in the boot and cove stripes. This is apparent, where they are exposed on the inside and you can see the sun shining through them. It's even more apparent when you sand the hull down to bare plastic. (I was initially worried about "loosing" the stripe when I did this.) Anyhow, I'd bet that the factory stripe is pretty much permanent.
 
Last edited:

Loren Beach

O34 - Portland, OR
Senior Moderator
Blogs Author
Whither the Waterline

You guys are way more complicated than me (am). To I, level is what looks level.

If my paint waterline were wrong (submerged, uneven, wavy), I would observe the boat sitting in the water looking good, then mark the hull there.

I 'd bring the new bottom paint up three or even four full inches above that line, leave an inch or so of white gel coat, and add the decorative boot top stripe.

Many smaller cruisers, when weighed down with junk and people for a cruise, are down on their lines. I get growth on the boot top, and wish I had the margin of bottom paint to handle it.

Good observation! :rolleyes:

In our first decade, we moved the bottom paint top margin up twice. It's ok now, about an inch up onto the WL stripe!

Loren
 

Leander

Member II
After fitting a few pieces of cabinetry to my boat, I find it apparent that no part of it is square or level and very few parts are straight. Boatbuilders minds must be fundamentally different from carpenters. :rolleyes:
However, re the boot stripe, I believe that mine is not just "painted on." The gel coat is actually a different color in the boot and cove stripes. This is apparent, where they are exposed on the inside and you can see the sun shining through them. It's even more apparent when you sand the hull down to bare plastic. (I was initially worried about "loosing" the stripe when I did this.) Anyhow, I'd bet that the factory stripe is pretty much permanent.

It's not permanent when you've ground off every layer of paint and the gelcoat, too, as on my boat! My hull has been all the way down to bare glass with no paint, and then had a new layer of fiberglass cloth added on. However, your answer probably does apply to the vast majority of Ericson owners.

Thanks,
leander
 

Leander

Member II
Painting hull high

You guys are way more complicated than me (am). To I, level is what looks level.

If my paint waterline were wrong (submerged, uneven, wavy), I would observe the boat sitting in the water looking good, then mark the hull there.

I 'd bring the new bottom paint up three or even four full inches above that line, leave an inch or so of white gel coat, and add the decorative boot top stripe.

Many smaller cruisers, when weighed down with junk and people for a cruise, are down on their lines. I get growth on the boot top, and wish I had the margin of bottom paint to handle it.

This makes a lot of sense, Christian.

Thanks,
Leander
 

Afrakes

Sustaining Member
Actual water line

My former 73' E-27 didn't lay on her factory lines when I got her. With the weight evenly distributed, all tanks about half full, I swam around the boat on a very quiet summer morning and marked where the actual waterline was with a permanent marker. The next season when I completely stripped the bottom in preparation for barrier coating and new bottom paint I adjusted the lines accordingly. I ran the bottom paint about three inches above the marks. Fully loaded she settled pretty close to those lines.
 
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