Having new main sail made for my E27. Loose foot or roped foot?

knowledge and opinions needed on whether to have the new sail made with loose foot or rope footed as my existing sail is. Thanks for the advice ahead of time!

"Foot Loose" --- might make a good movie

Scott Abbott said:

knowledge and opinions needed on whether to have the new sail made with loose foot or rope footed as my existing sail is. Thanks for the advice ahead of time!

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Given that loose-footed mains have been around since the early 80's, I would say that they are nowadays the norm. It's been decades since we have had slugs on a foot. Before that change, sailmakers were putting a "flat" cloth foot section to allow the lower part of the main to maintain a designed-in natural shape, so the goal was always to let the whole sail have an efficient curve.

We might be talking only a couple of nano-knots of boat speed here, but I will take 'em... The sail is a little cheaper (i.e. less labor for that part of it) to construct, too. So you save a little money and hopefully gain a little speed.

If you have strong feelings, either way, it's not worth any argument.
Your boat - your rules.

Note:
There are several prior threads here that discuss this.
Here's one, and while it gets into more commentary than just main sails and loose feet, there is some great info from a sailmaker (reply 6).
http://www.ericsonyachts.org/infoex...?3239-Loose-Footed-Main-and-Mid-Boom-Sheeting


Cheers,
Loren

Loose foot again on my E27. Versatile (with regard to reefing lines), easy to remove and install.

Loose Foot

I replaced my rope foot main with a loose foot this past season and am very happy with it.

Don

We Owned an E-27 for years. Went to Loose footed mains in the 80's as stated previously. Big advantage to me is ease of attach /removal (Bending on the sail) , ease of outhaul, less rainwater spilling out, no shrinkage of the bolt, and lastly easy to tie some reef knots (if desired) The last bolted foot main we had required a flattening cringle in the sail just to make up for the extra draft they used to have to build into these types of sails. Thats a long while ago for those who know of what I speak. You wont regret the loose foot. It's all that is used today for a reason.
Best of luck! Capt. Ian

I love loose foot - you get a better way to shape the sail for all conditions.

I'm trying to figure out why all cruising mains used to have foot slugs on a track. They were a pain, hard to load, and when worn interfered with the outhaul, which was often useless anyhow.

Maybe it was roller furling, once state-of-the-art. Maybe it was some theoretical aero end-plate thing, unlikely to be persuasive in the messy air over a cruising cabin house on a heeled boat in a seaway. Maybe it was just tradition, and when sail cloth got bulletproof and computers ran the stitching that changed. Maybe with mid-boom sheeting, itself new, buyers felt there'd be more strain on the boom. Maybe it's just cheaper. Anyhow, it's now a no-brainer.

But I had the same question two years ago when ordering a new mainsail. The sailmaker, Oliver at UK here, just laughed. "You want loose footed," he said.

Outhaul now in play. Easy to take the main off. Easy to tie and release the reef points. Sail looks better, too, more like a Laser than a square-rigger.

Christian Williams said:

I'm trying to figure out why all cruising mains used to have foot slugs on a track. They were a pain, hard to load, and when worn interfered with the outhaul, which was often useless anyhow.

Maybe it was roller furling, once state-of-the-art. Maybe it was some theoretical aero end-plate thing, unlikely to be persuasive in the messy air over a cruising cabin house on a heeled boat in a seaway. Maybe it was just tradition, and when sail cloth got bulletproof and computers ran the stitching that changed. Maybe with mid-boom sheeting, itself new, buyers felt there'd be more strain on the boom. Maybe it's just cheaper. Anyhow, it's now a no-brainer.

But I had the same question two years ago when ordering a new mainsail. The sailmaker, Oliver at UK here, just laughed. "You want loose footed," he said.

Outhaul now in play. Easy to take the main off. Easy to tie and release the reef points. Sail looks better, too, more like a Laser than a square-rigger.

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Time for a Famous movie reference: "Plastics my boy" .....!

Those earlier-generation natural fabric sails, cotton or flax, would stretch easily and had to be supported in as many places as possible. Lots of slugs attaching the two side sides where a main could be attached.

Dacron was a lot stronger and could easily be woven to have more strength along any chosen axis. It took a few years for customers to accept that the foot could be loose and the sail cloth still be just as strong in actual use. When racers led the way in the late 70's, cruisers started noticing.

As for skepticism, I still recall one of my early my conversations with the loft mgr at UK Northwest when I needed a new dac main. I was wondering how the connection to the boom could be adequate without all those slugs and manager Tim Knight gently reminded me that when I would reef in heavy air ALL of the clew force was on one reinforced point at the aft corner of the main.
Given the lesser force exerted by the full main in lighter air, of course the loose foot concept would work! The light came on and I said "well duh" or something like that.



Regards,
Loren

Thanks for all the responses! Loose foot it is. Confirmed yesterday. Thanks much!

wooden spars?

I think we can also speculate about wooden spars being the traditional way to support those non dacron sails in the past. I have a friend with a wooden boom and his outhaul is hardly anything substantial -- it's actually two wood screws holding a block that will come off in the first blow.... so if he were to convert his main to loose footed he would have to get a whole attachment track so the block does not fail easily. It may be that the slugs were needed both due to the fabric as well as the wooden spars maybe, to make things cheaper to build? The slugs attached to the boom can spread the up and diagonal force more evenly maybe. Just speculating...

In any case, the flow escaping between the sail and the boom along the loose foot is essential to optimum sail shape, as I understood it, and I saw a noticeable increase in speed when I switched to loose footed.

Oh yes, one other thing about loose-foot: you can tie the reef lines around the boom. Saves all that slab reefing hardware.

And yet...here's a real man with a real boom and a real mainsail. This picture is over my desk and reminds me not to worry too much about subtleties.

Cool picture, Christian! I think I know that guy. He has a hard time keeping crew, though, with the way he uses that hammer on 'em!:0

Urmmm....

Keith Parcells said:

Cool picture, Christian! I think I know that guy. He has a hard time keeping crew, though, with the way he uses that hammer on 'em!:0

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The beatings will continue until moral improves, seriously...I mean it this time.